Parks and Recreation Board – June 13, 2022

Video Description:

Parks and Recreation Board – June 13, 2022

Note: The following is the output of transcribing from a video recording. Although the transcription, which was done with software, is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or [software] transcription errors. It is posted as an aid to understanding the proceedings at the meeting, but should not be treated as an authoritative record.

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Unknown Speaker 0:00
I would like to call this meeting at the Parks and Rec advisory board where Jupiter keeps wanting to see me make these happen all across this area up here was the SWAT funnel here. Mr. Jeff Elbonian. Mr. Manuel? It says Mr. Nicolas Lavon.

Unknown Speaker 0:28
Mr. Donaldson here. And Mr.

Unknown Speaker 0:30
Tim waters. Thank you so much today. Genda. Does anyone have any additions to?

Unknown Speaker 0:43
Yes, I would

Unknown Speaker 0:44
like to propose that we add a discussion about proud field trip to the

Unknown Speaker 0:53
business. Yes.

Unknown Speaker 0:56
Any discussion? Any other additions to the agenda? If not, can I get a motion to approve the agenda as amended and move to approve the agenda as amended. Second? I wasn’t paper. Hot. Okay, well in advance you the minute it lets you know, they came just this morning. But Did anyone have a chance to review them? All? Yeah. Did you have any changes?

Unknown Speaker 1:38
came yesterday,

Unknown Speaker 1:39
yesterday? Okay, so we need a motion to make a

Unknown Speaker 1:51
motion to approve them at nine parts? Sorry.

Unknown Speaker 2:05
We don’t have any public invited speaker. You can make comments. Great. Okay. Well, thank you all. So

Unknown Speaker 2:20
I just wanted to make sure that you all know about the proposal from the city manager presented to council about the quality of life tax. Has everybody heard about it? No. Okay. So the meeting, it was towards the middle of May, he presented this info. And what what he is a thought council about console is, at least without voting, showing some interest in trying to go to a quality of life tax that would provide support to a library, recreation, museum, parks, and the performing arts. And the thought is, is that all of these these areas need additional operating funds, as well as some additional space museum has a plan that would add square footage to the existing Museum. The library is partway through of a feasibility study. That study has identified that there should maybe be two or three branch libraries along with the central library. We all have talked about a new recreation facility, parks, needs operational dollars as well as some support to move projects up on the list instead of all of us being told three to five years before something’s done that maybe just seen if you’re listening over there, they could possibly move those up sooner and then some form of funding also for the proposed performing arts. So this this is another basically provide both dollars to build these facilities add on to the facilities and operational dollars. And then of course with recreation and Museum, the potential to bring in additional revenue into the city. So funding options and of course, not doing any more is always an option. Or even reducing services. That’s something that is always a possibility but certainly not why we are going to try to move forward with the Tax tax will be dedicated for those areas that we just talked about. Or another option would be to create a district that would possibly uncover all of our encompass all of those areas. Part of what’s going on with the library, physic feasibility study, is there also as a group interested in a library not providing services through the city anymore, creating a separate district that would offer library services

Unknown Speaker 5:36
and sectional data dedicated tax and

Unknown Speaker 5:40
a general tax could be used anywhere in the city? Or if it’s dedicated to those areas, it can only be used for those five. Museum library, recreation parks yesterday,

Unknown Speaker 5:56
did they say this? Was the mill levy tax on property or more like a sales tax or another tax?

Unknown Speaker 6:01
I believe they’ve talked about property tax, but but this is very early on. And so it really is just in the discussion, early discussion stage right now.

Unknown Speaker 6:13
They didn’t talk about how much of a tax was going on. We don’t know the numbers

Unknown Speaker 6:17
of whatever it costs to do all those things, yet staff are meeting monthly to start developing those costs.

Unknown Speaker 6:28
These facilities in this century

Unknown Speaker 6:31
bond. So like the Recreation Center Museum was through a bond or we have to use

Unknown Speaker 6:38
sales tax. Yes. I’m not sure to see property

Unknown Speaker 6:42
tax. Yeah, yes. Okay. That you pay property tax to the saver and I thought it was about but schools school district. But it would expand the levels of service, maintain services in economic downturns. And this election would take place in November of 23. So we have some time to develop what the cost really could be. And if it’s realistic to ask for that kind of tax, meaning how much is

Unknown Speaker 7:17
that in a vote on the taxes? I need a vote on all the things we’d like to do if the tax is an all in one.

Unknown Speaker 7:23
It’d be all on one is the belief right now that you’d vote for the tax that would make all those things happen,

Unknown Speaker 7:29
including building the restaurant?

Unknown Speaker 7:31
Yes. Well, if we get our ducks in a row, yes.

Unknown Speaker 7:36
But again, it’s November of next year,

Unknown Speaker 7:39
which is kind of what we have discussed as a rec center.

Unknown Speaker 7:42
Yeah. Yes.

Unknown Speaker 7:45
Are you still I know, that’s to me talk. There was a funding item for the feasibility study that was somebody conservative. Is that still?

Unknown Speaker 7:53
Yes. Yeah, it hasn’t been it hasn’t gone constantly up. I thought it would be done by now. But it hasn’t. As soon as that is completed, we will then go to an RFP to hire a consultant.

Unknown Speaker 8:10
Do we need to step up there and make that happen for counsel?

Unknown Speaker 8:14
Who said it hadn’t gone in comps? No, it’s It’s in finance and finance deals with that. They’re closing out all the books for 2022. So they can’t do that appropriation until that’s done. They’re at the very end of that equity.

Unknown Speaker 8:32

Unknown Speaker 8:33
possible community involvement, identify projects and costs, operational needs. We want to make sure that the community is involved along the way, so that they know what we’re proposing and saying what we’re proposing. And hopefully, that would encourage them also to vote for them. Then there’ll be some later in the year more of a formal direction from council about how we move forward. And then I think they have to put it on the ballot. August of 23. For it to be in November, which is the only time the city can can do this kind of election.

Unknown Speaker 9:20
That’s does anybody have some?

Unknown Speaker 9:24
Yeah, I think four columns is a good example of this type of tax.

Unknown Speaker 9:33
What is the sunset on the current Rec Center Museum Senior Center, well

Unknown Speaker 9:40
done. That already happens yet again in 2018 2018. Voters continued those those dollars to be used for Civic Center, electrical fire stations, and some golf projects.

Unknown Speaker 9:58
And that’s a sales tax.

Unknown Speaker 9:59
Yes. Same extension of what people were paying for the decision 99, which is Museum, rec center, and Roosevelt coffin rush. So again, very early stages, and we’ll keep you informed. I’m sure that at some point in time, we’ll be bringing the different advisory boards together to get everybody’s input. And their thoughts on moving forward. David, do you have anything you would add No. Questions again, early, early on.

Unknown Speaker 10:39
Are you nervous that it’s just too big? Everything I mean, especially the performing arts center that get pulled on by itself,

Unknown Speaker 10:47
right. And it’s my understanding that the performing arts is better. There’s another study, going a little bit deeper than the first study to really identify that private public partnership fee was 158 million or something first. But again, score so early on, I don’t know what the number is. But the challenge is, whoever goes first may get funded. But or people might say, Well, I’m not going to vote for the library. Because I want a rec center. I want the so coming all together, we feel like it offers something for everybody. Yeah, I guess

Unknown Speaker 11:29
my knee jerk reaction feels like competitive buy stock, right? A little bit. performing arts centers, a giant piece, right? Go the other ones. And I would agree, it’s, it’s something that hasn’t been really sussed out in the public. Right? And so it’s something that could kill everything. Because it’s only seeing a loan viability. Let’s see.

Unknown Speaker 11:54
Yes, I would agree. But again, it’s it’s very early on.

Unknown Speaker 11:58
I don’t know what I mean, is this going to be but what is the pastor continuing with this? I mean, credit counseling, and we wanted to provide feedback to the council mates to that 10 sectors.

Unknown Speaker 12:14
But then we can talk about it again next month, when Tim is here. I don’t have the answer for that. Staff is meeting and talking about what what was weird identify? And my guess is that then it starts going out to boards and and to the public to start getting the comment. Are you guys crazy? Or like the idea?

Unknown Speaker 12:41
Yeah, great to give a really robust early polling. Thank you.

Unknown Speaker 13:05
Next to sit right here and

Unknown Speaker 13:17
after, thank you.

Unknown Speaker 13:24
So the first piece that I was asked to talk about is the implementation I finished with the passing of the ordinances for the change in park hours in the neighborhood parks, the shelter reservations, and the definition of camping, I think we’ve went through those all as a group pretty well. But that really went into effect on June 4. And it was kind of a scramble, because we didn’t know we had to wait for council to give us direction to do that. So we got that done. And staff that went out and had to do we actually got on board, like how many signs would it take to change out I think it remember, we had never that we changed our sizes based on $5,000. We actually went with the bat and you know, we have to do a brand new coming up in the future and will be new size. So in the interim, basically doing vinyl text to go over the old language to the park hours and put that up onto the sign. So it’s taking a little bit of work that after we got that figured out. Because we think of all the years are in science, I think we have 12 Different fonts 12 different sizes, a character so you’ve been trying to match that I think are quite now with individuals who are working in those parks that are going to have those stickers and take out and give them up on the sign so either went into effect on the for the goal for the player to the Rangers particular to have to be out there writing people tickets for violations, rules and rights and what isn’t really certain compensation and talking to people about why we’re trying to make our parks a little safer by getting people to use in the most effective way possible for those lighted areas. And after those hours after the wonderful darkness that it really is controlled Do some other behaviors. So at this point I’ve had no Rangers come back to you. So they didn’t have that conversation with anyone yet. So we’ll see how that goes. So if you want take these one at a time and ask questions about that, if you have a neighborhood party, you’ve either seen the stickers go up yet, or you haven’t, or you’ve seen, seen or heard feedback from your community about how this is really impacting to the use of those parts.

Unknown Speaker 15:26
I haven’t noticed yet. But maybe.

Unknown Speaker 15:36
Okay, so Friday night, I got voluntold to stay in the TVs up in New Zealand. So if you analyze, and didn’t see very well, and wake up the log folder switches that were like, jump over the fence investigating TVs, toys, and books to fight in front around about memorizing these really cool, hey, let’s go to the park and swing on the swings. So that’s my input. But teenagers want to do the 2am good swing on the swings. And I’m all for it.

Unknown Speaker 16:12
So and I just just to kind of re iterate the fact that you know, even before this change that would have been against it, I think most of our PD and Rangers and stuff that would be out there in the morning it was going to be if there’s something happening that looks like they’re swinging with alcohol in our hand are scraping sustainability to talk to you and then they seem engrossed by in the morning, see some more mouth as our represents that it wouldn’t be the ability to contact those people. And make sure that like there was usually something that we hope is happening to damage our system.

Unknown Speaker 16:48
I just hope it doesn’t disproportionately affect people of color, or minority status or different page when? Because if they saw me absolutely understands, I doubt anybody would say that. But yes.

Unknown Speaker 17:07
So we will, we can definitely, he did something, you know, because I do definitely have my Rangers Keep calm, keep track and stats of how many contacts you make for a dog off leash or after our water alcohol violations. If it was a verbal warning, if it was a written warning, if it was a citation. So we we have some of that information. But again, unless it’s a citation, rather than asking people there, there are agents out there. So they’ll probably have some conversations, we haven’t quite started seeing certain parts with certain numbers of contracts that are disproportionate to other areas, we can definitely start talking about breaking the chucks. Is this looking like something that a certain demographic or not, but at this point, it’s really not that we don’t believe that those conversations?

Unknown Speaker 17:52
Could we have an update at the end of the

Unknown Speaker 17:55
summer? Decision? Yes. I can have the night. The next one was the camping piece. And that one, really, we had no signs in our neighborhood parks that said no camping is right now that’s really what we have, we have a say, a sign that says no after hours camping, and some of our other parks, as we went through there before, there’s nothing that said that there. So right now we’ll just be as thrown out. People have to kind of know the rules and rights and again and see the idea of what we’re seeing out there that would have a negative impact on the system. So we again, will be having this conversation. So people are out there losing the park and those that are setting up to kind of move in. The Rangers have been trained as hard to train, the person you’re doing is asking see people need services, where they can get that help. And then they give them that time, even if even is over two hours are going to give them that point. So you have 24 hours to either move on and try to take some of the services. So again, we have not seen that vehicle purchase this time. So the questions do come up again about if it’s being used for use sports and stuff. And people look at the shape tents up. And I think Jeff has talked about that. And those typically don’t have a lease on or some of those are a rental agreement, but are the contact person won’t be there. And most of those are done within two hours. So we haven’t seen any of those challenges yet, either. And again for the purpose. And then the last one is the shelter reservations. And that was really the same if you’re going to have more than 15 people or can be the more than two hours you need to have that reservation the same way you would be if you wanted to have first priority. I didn’t have us think to make sure you get that that reservation in Japan if you’ve seen any reservations coming in the recreation does our purpose patients for the city, the parks and our staff about them for the reservation sign up saying that this shelter is reserved for this group at this time. So that way if somebody is using it, you got to be willing to ask them to leave because you do have the priority.

Unknown Speaker 19:57
I haven’t seen any impact To

Unknown Speaker 20:00
the meter, or for

Unknown Speaker 20:02
those who paid and

Unknown Speaker 20:05
congratulation we can for

Unknown Speaker 20:12
every book prior to COVID, we had from 1500. Shelter reservations in the year. We’re heading back into that direction.

Unknown Speaker 20:24
And Jeff, do you know offhand I had looked up at the net of council what the reservation prices are 6565. And council member of the dollar, Barry was the one that was kind of concerned about that impact and having her come from California, she was kind of shocked at how little that price really was to be able to take a shelter for the whole day. It’s only two hours a whole day, I think, you know,

Unknown Speaker 20:48
just to cover you’re setting the whole day, as you say, two hours.

Unknown Speaker 20:52
You don’t want anything, you need to have reservations more than two hours if you have a graduation, and it’s only one hour, but you want to guarantee you’d have it for that hour. It’s the same piece, you need the reservation, that reservation really does give it to you for the whole day. But I’m not sure if we put a time slot here because I know we do get multiple reservations one day for one shelter, same stone

Unknown Speaker 21:10
has a has a different our

Unknown Speaker 21:16
Yeah, the group shelter that that’s a bigger pavilion. So that is an hourly rate for that

Unknown Speaker 21:22
I’m looking right now at a pm for all right.

Unknown Speaker 21:28
And we don’t usually do multiple, because it’s too difficult to clean up and be like between the granton’s.

Unknown Speaker 21:38
So what I’ve probably kind of heard right now is, as we’re going through the season, kind of looking for the things that you know, in that equity lab is how this is impacting the community and also be ready to give a update and the year and how this really was used throughout our education, our enforcement and ability to help manage the parks to go to the next season. So

Unknown Speaker 22:00
yeah, it’d be great to have an overview and hear what worked well. And if there were any challenges,

Unknown Speaker 22:07
you response rates.

Unknown Speaker 22:13
And again, that’s one of the reasons I think, you know, that, as they looked at do this, see why I think Carol and the group that wasn’t leading this every impact team, look at if we did displacement, you have to go and change our territory, because this way, it really is open to the city wide we can address it as soon as that happens. We we are working with those individuals. The waters secret

Unknown Speaker 22:37
is, is given here in Mexico. I’m just curious in bad looking. And I’m just wondering, I see a bunch of fields on here. And it says you can reserve fields for an hour at a time is that a lot of debt? If you try to do it, it says increasingly, reservations cannot be made online. So Can people constantly call up and settle up? Based off? Because it’s not over to the baseball pitch? Are you seeing on this website? It’s not just shelters, you can book all sorts of other amenities that the parks,

Unknown Speaker 23:11
you can’t do field reservations, because we have so many user groups that you have to talk directly with our athletic staff to reserve those.

Unknown Speaker 23:22
Okay. So they’re listed here, but they’re not actually available.

Unknown Speaker 23:25
Not not online. Several waves? No. I don’t have that authority to do that.

Unknown Speaker 23:38
And there’s no scholarship program or anything like that. For your grant program. One thing that I know somebody from California sent $65 isn’t much but somebody from my neighborhood, including me, I wouldn’t have been able to $65 within the entire budget for my kid’s birthday party, including his present. So that would

Unknown Speaker 24:05
go to four days of just trying to get it right.

Unknown Speaker 24:08
Yeah. I agree. Yeah. The people that the people that have the money for that are going to you know, the jumping place or whatever. You know, I think six $5 is a lot I think $15 is

Unknown Speaker 24:29
not right. It again, this is trying to get that compromise was horrible. That really does because it was done talked about if you have the reservation on Friday and Saturday, Sunday, really the staff coming in cleaning those changing trash can and respiratory and and that’s about as close as possible there’s a city is trying to strike a balance between making it equitable to the community that also trying to cover some of those costs.

Unknown Speaker 25:03
Are we move on to new business? Welcome cancer advice

Unknown Speaker 25:11
if you are apologetic I’m more focused on touring I guess.

Unknown Speaker 25:21
Okay, your business. I think the new business that is new again, it’s FDIC great forest health partnership and I’m not sure who all has heard about this partnership. I think your chairs one to saw some of the information out there either online or hard copies of what some of the tours are around the button rock area really up and what we’re looking at as a force, you know, this horseshit that really fires shed that doesn’t have really clear jurisdictional lines, fires don’t respect those any more than wildlife or water does. So we’ve been working since 2019, is when constantly directed us to see how we can better job working cross boundary across our forefathers to try to help preserve our watershed as well as pieces is sometimes people don’t get that connection to support yourself and water health as something that a lot of different communities are working on. I think Denver’s calling it force forest faucet, looking at how they manage their watersheds through that connection of if we have a devastating wildfire. Up in our watershed, one button block will that impact with the DNR drinking water and wildlife. But rock is a significantly challenging place for forestry because of the topography up there. And how long has it been since we’ve done some good forest work out there. So and 2019 We were directed to do this, we were able to work with the same brain, left hand Water Conservancy District and some of those individuals were using the water bottle, and then work with them to really build off of what was already in place. As far as it was known in Colorado, Colorado fire shed collaborative, which is more of a regional piece, there is a Boulder County Fire shed. And then out of that we built the st reinforced Health Partnership. And I’m not sure if you’ve seen some news documents and how long it has been designed to death. But I guess more for next time the pieces that price Hadley our range of a button rock on top of doing all the rangering all the managing the water he’s been working all these rats and working on trying to make sure we stay involved and engaged and so if you want more detail on some of these pieces pricing come back in but he’s actually elders recently trying to get a little bit higher level just so that partnership becomes really more local focus on that black rock fire shed is locked in water. Shed Senator Boulder County US Forest Service, USDA say they’d love to have Water Conservancy District left hand water Longmont in Boulder Valley to soil conservation districts, Longmont and the Colorado State Forest Service. So in that partnership, it really was the ability to go out and look for grants looking at things because we’re looking at things that I properly scale, it’s hard to really accomplish things. So if you can look back and say we can do a horrific project that’s going to create the Forest Service Boulder County in Longmont. And it’s going to be a 400 acre project. And we don’t care about what bond VLANs are, we care about protecting the poorest in the water health. That’s the reason we want to get to a state of any single fellas out there to help these watersheds. So we got that put in place. And we have I think four separate IG A’s coming into place from your work with the service agencies. But in the meantime, we actually put in for a grant to do it, which is 440 acres of forest we have run button lock and that was a winning grant. So I just got that last week. So we will have a a project that will be doing over 400 acres of the parking lot to try to mitigate some of the high impact fire areas we really can find that that catastrophic fires, one of the grants that we will receive was through co swapping. We’ve got up in Colorado alliance of some sort that allows us to get here got huge for motor County we also have more of an America from the Larimer County so our youth work is a great program gets kids out in the in nature they learned about a lot of things are working on we get some good trail work hands, we’ll work with them but they can’t step on a ladder. They can’t do things that have power tools or whatever counting who is able to do actual forestry with the chainsaw. So we’ll be able to get some additional work done from that grouping of people too. So one really good things coming out of this collaboration from Boulder County Commissioners to city council to the Forest Service along the front range that button rock area really has risen to the top is an area that we really need to do more for our for sale or watershed our visitor experience and for wildlife And I think the last thing was endure a couple of ways you can get online and register for some events ago talking about people doing this work. And we want to,

Unknown Speaker 30:14
but not unfortunately was June 7. The next one coming up is Raymond and that’s going to be July 9 teeth. Old stage the hill, but Tamkang in August 9, and then famous brings b l, on August 18. And we include those in the notes in the minutes. So that as you want to log on and kind of look at us a little bit. That’s really nice thing about this flower that because it really is all those municipalities, communities, that are really interested in helping protect this forest. So they’re really gave a lot of choice by doing this.

Unknown Speaker 30:51
So just add, there’s also so this larger St. Green Forest Hill partnership, they put together a story map, that’s pretty cool on mine to make sure that we send out the link, it kind of just talks about the purposes of global partnership, what kind of course they’re doing. And then working with the US Forest Service. They’ve actually just fly collaborative is looking at work on forest service land, as well as associated jurisdictions. And for the Forest Service, all of these different partners are helping them with that. So that NEPA analysis National Environmental Policy Act. And so they have a proposal for projects throughout their whole partnership area that is open for public comments from June 8 to July 8. And so I wanted to make sure that you all knew about that and couldn’t go with Kevin, if you wanted to promote public comment, because it will have relevance to the Forest Service lands in our watershed.

Unknown Speaker 31:50
And I appreciate that, because there’s so many pieces of this. And it really could be someone who’s been on price or can do some damage here to do a little bit more than this. But the Joint Chiefs and really the chiefs in the Forest Service USDA, they really came out to say we want to do more, but we recognize me come in at the top level chiefs of these divisions, you come into SmartMusic, we’re here to help you and we’re going to clear this forest, we’re going to do so prescribed burns, and we’re going to make the forest look different and be more healthy to be healthier. They get a lot of pushback on that, especially among communities. So what they have really done with this piece is trying to be more bottom up. They’re really trying to read it reach out to those James sounds in his words, and long months and Mayans so that they can build that grassroots piece and say, Here’s projects you’d like to see in our community, in collaboration for service, can you help on that? And as opposed to a coming with dollars for your project in your backyard? So that’s a little bit of how this this really got set up? I think they’ve learned some lessons up run, fulfill.

Unknown Speaker 32:55
So will there be volunteer? Opportunities? Suppose

Unknown Speaker 33:00
that’s a good question I have Sure. In this, there will be my theater account. I actually think in terms of past Taylor’s office, I don’t go past it, because every time I go past it, I have no idea for her for another doctor. So I try to give her a little bit of room but that’s one of these as I told you to walk you through the day that’s going to help myself sat down and just chatted and said, you know, where do you see this program in five years and she said some great ideas,

Unknown Speaker 33:25
even little smallness and somebody else at 75 or even collecting

Unknown Speaker 33:35
for sale art with you again and that’s a great piece to one of the collaborations we have learned to counsel out these these four is that for years we’ve been you know, Walmart and the Forest Service, Longmont, Boulder County all security has these challenges of you know, we can go and make a spot and we can do the forest work, we can build a slush pile, but it gets the slash piles, you really just rearranging fuels unless you get a chance to burn those in some of those areas is a great challenge to how do you mitigate that fire design control. So the best thing to do is add wood out of there. And that really means when it crosses over the landlord’s property so we won’t be collaborating for the county to use some of their access roads to take it out at all ranch and they will use it to park as their their firewood sale project and to do so some of those volunteers are working properly. This is great a lot of really positive things pretty quickly and hopefully either a neighbor’s Park sentence continue and then know whether things were really comfortable for counties they do need to have that area of man so that people come up to five five whether they have the permit or the necessary place for some additional help is how we demand that firewood definitely courteous,

Unknown Speaker 34:49
yeah. It covered there mom. Mom made fun of a lot of stuff the private sale Questions and Questions? Thank you passenger. There any items from the topics? Any questions? So,

Unknown Speaker 35:47
I have a question and I think David is going to be directed to you because Kathy is in here and you’re welcome to say, I’ll ask Kathy. I don’t normally go remember he asked me because I recently visited car park on page six. It talks about car park playground replacement. And it says warranty work is complete. And final acceptance is an issue for the product having never visited before. Just last weekend when I went, there’s a really cool playground feature that looks like it’s been taken apart. So I guess I wanted to ask her slash shoe does anyone know? There’s like this giant zipline looking cool thing? It looks like it’s been disassembled. So I guess I’m wondering hasn’t really the warranty work done? Because it doesn’t look done. People department talking about how it used to work, and then it got taken apart?

Unknown Speaker 36:33
So we had some vandalism out there. I know at one point, but it was called the zipline piece. I’m not sure if that is I’ll have to ask Kathy

Unknown Speaker 36:43
is it looks like a roller coaster. The whole thing you hold on to is gone. Yeah. So I’m just curious people in the parks that it was there like a month ago and suddenly it wasn’t.

Unknown Speaker 36:52
So I did hear from God group about we had some menus and all of that. All right. So

Unknown Speaker 36:56
the parents were assuming it was just too dangerous because it looks crazy. It looks really fun. I’ve never seen anything like that before. I’m just curious.

Unknown Speaker 37:11
Get vandalized that I’m sure the purpose of it is people that are I don’t know what it is why in a lot of countries. Yeah, that’s what

Unknown Speaker 37:21
it looks like. It will be time for everyone including an adult. It’s a pretty massive looking.

Unknown Speaker 37:25
Yeah. I just realized we put last month’s record update in there. So we already two

Unknown Speaker 37:41
updates that we’re missing that you want to share with us know anything.

Unknown Speaker 37:47
So that’s a pool of really busy weathers so on from 16.

Unknown Speaker 37:59
Any other questions from the packet?

Unknown Speaker 38:06
What are you going to talk about the ship trip?

Unknown Speaker 38:09
We amended it in nine items. Well, that’s just right. Let’s just go back and talk about the Ultra, those of you that have gone before any of you only Dan and I think memoranda and field trips, but we did do a field trip last last year we had I don’t know man, I prefer us to do this and we did sort of looking at some of the pack Today we went to Dickens and looked at some of the other areas of my lifetime. So you know I think it’s generally a good opportunity to get out and see some of the things that we talked about regularly before I started the board the last field trip was maybe a button rock Yeah. So is there any idea what people would like to see

Unknown Speaker 39:24
to get ready to rock tomorrow if it was this is not the retreat. This is the field

Unknown Speaker 39:45
Steve’s not here but I’m curious about all the various parks that are under construction are about to be just finished when we’ve talked about them and and picturing I can’t even say all the names one by one. Hi, Steven Davis done. But that trail out to you rose. You know, we’ve just discussed these various things. I don’t know if it’s the one that’s going to be south of the Rec Center. Maybe there’s nothing to see there yet. Did we go there? Well, I, I wasn’t on last year. The field.

Unknown Speaker 40:19
Right. So, you know, Gallo is

Unknown Speaker 40:22
that’s how I was thinking. But I didn’t realize you guys went through last year in our mind.

Unknown Speaker 40:28
And a new bill is the one that just says they’re about to start, right.

Unknown Speaker 40:32
I just could write 101 That’s by Southwest most just east of 75th. Kathy, over meadow. Yeah, whatever. That one that Steve talked about there. I mean, I know all of these are just getting going or, you know, maybe, maybe that’s what we did last year. I missed the trip.

Unknown Speaker 40:56
I don’t didn’t do was we didn’t do.

Unknown Speaker 41:00
Dry Creek is as far west as we went last year. So. But again, we’re moving out that and making some decisions as well. All right,

Unknown Speaker 41:10
it was just an idea.

Unknown Speaker 41:15
Thank you. It’s your job set up. So I think you were jumping back. I think it’s interesting that the idea that we visit like other recreation. I was

Unknown Speaker 41:25
I wasn’t joking, because I was talking about like a pets. You know, what is the one in our bio that’s combined with so many really cool things. Sound like that was the direction we were sort of maybe expected to be done. That was that was joking in a real way. All right.

Unknown Speaker 41:40
Jeff, we have any idea what they pay tax wise for apex or have paid for this? We could find out? Yep. Hard. But I mean, it’s publicly funded. It’s not a private thing. It’s like going on a test. And it’s what a facility. I mean, it’s two different things. There’s a tennis thing, and then there’s the Rec Center. What it’s like, miles apart. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, it’s must be big money. I’m just curious what it is, what are maybe what the district size is, you know, how many people are we talking that pay for that or get to use it or?

Unknown Speaker 42:25
More always had to be careful about which thing I put in Google Design, along with lace

Unknown Speaker 42:31
CEF, if you’re gonna if you’re gonna follow up with are just building a dance question about the size because I know that directly. Yep. All right. Oh, gotcha. The footprint. If there’s more information you could get like assessed valuation on I’m assuming that they’re their funding that would maybe sales tax. Well, however, it’s been fun. But I know, our data has a number of special districts and they have a fire district, our public safety district very differently than how long one has approached these things. But this quality of life tax, if it gets like, this would look a lot more like our data then over the next cat decade or so. So, you know, go down until dance interest would be helpful.

Unknown Speaker 43:24
Okay, Jeff presented the quality of life hopefully arrive. So we’re now coming up the speed of your discussions. We believe the golden

Unknown Speaker 43:37
age that

Unknown Speaker 43:42
was 10 years ago, but it was still before that. So many times down, like having segments that are

Unknown Speaker 43:54
public or private. It’s

Unknown Speaker 43:58
South Suburban. And it’s like huge facility that goes into this pod in their indoor soccer. They got lucky they get tenants, like correct so far.

Unknown Speaker 44:12
So how could a helicopter for this? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 44:16
That would be more than Yeah, that would be a long future. That will have to come out of the parks. But yeah. So I think we do maybe I think we’re still sort of talking about this lightly, but I do think there’s some interest so it might be good if we can at least get some more background, starting, you know, maybe with our data or if there are others that are similar to COVID

Unknown Speaker 44:39
belly just feel alone, or the

Unknown Speaker 44:43
new Rock Center. Yeah, no, they just approvable no fail. Oh, Phil

Unknown Speaker 44:48
Murphy has a new one. That’ll be part of whatever. RFP I mean, whatever concern we hire will mean I remember last time they generate all the A, quote competition slash, you know,

Unknown Speaker 45:03
sort of scourge of

Unknown Speaker 45:07
epic or a valley or Lafayette, or, you know, the ones around here. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 45:16
Any other thoughts on potential field trips? I mean, I heard talking about the parks that like, you know, maybe visiting the parks that have been recently upgraded or near completion, that’s another sort of more traditional field, check it out. I’d be interested in one off as well. But

Unknown Speaker 45:36
we all hear about how great it was. And I also don’t even know where to start where to go. And I’m like, wish it was

Unknown Speaker 45:46
the place city spend most of the money and most most of the money is spent on the what money I mean, the money allocated to the parks, most of the money goes to build

Unknown Speaker 46:11
a dam expansion, there

Unknown Speaker 46:15
was already an extension. Was there? Is it

Unknown Speaker 46:20
reasonable to assume Yeah, gross, gross. So I think you know, the city of LA online has a decree that at some point, there could be an expansion of their reality of that happening. Those permitting processes are decade’s long. So I don’t know when that happened. I think what, you know, the city participated in the windy gap and how a project I think that was, you know, the route that was chosen to lay tried to achieve the water needs the city for, you know, the next kind of growth period for the near term, but there is a write up there, but that that reservoir could be expanded at some point.

Unknown Speaker 46:58
But union rose, and you’re supposed to expand and we have done lots of things out there. That’s another possible idea for necessery. You guys went last year. We didn’t do because we were now you know, we change the hours. The that trail that I can’t do. Spring Gulch goes. I mean, maybe there’s something there. I don’t know.

Unknown Speaker 47:20
worth our time. I’m not sure it was in this trail.

Unknown Speaker 47:23
Yeah, well, eventually all the way around, right. But that’s is that part of the expansion or previous to the expansion.

Unknown Speaker 47:32
So there’ll be two phases on that part of the expansion will be called the jig trail that kind of grew up on headquarters in North golf course. The Jim Hamm area then came down to around for the sale. But on the west side, yeah. So on the west side, a couple that went in and kind of move down the bottom, you got to close the sale of that. And then the long term plan has been approved is the full week Rhonda, the reservoir

Unknown Speaker 47:56
over to see great, right.

Unknown Speaker 48:00
So there’s potential from so spring, spring goes can get you down into sandstone. Sandstone is on the final phase of that one. But then as you go from Union reservoir going straight east 126 That is now all city on property until you get to the out of dairy, which we’re in the process of working at closing that deal right now that will get you all the safe part on that side, too. So it’ll be a loop up on that side as well. So Yes. Interesting.

Unknown Speaker 48:33
Spring Gulch is still the expansion isn’t happening yet. We own the land or

Unknown Speaker 48:41
for spring Gulch.

Unknown Speaker 48:44
John Sampson this

Unknown Speaker 48:45
year proposed Yes. So that that is that is it in the next phase? It’s actually now the schemer Kathy’s cue on that one that is actually an engineering replying to projects. Yeah, moving on warehouse capacity. So that next phase is going through genetic sets and engineering group, but that is proposed next year here. So okay, thanks.

Unknown Speaker 49:08
So I have captured so far potential ideas, I might be putting her up and can wake up like a forest management, water management, recreation and have a second would be visiting parks that have either been recently revitalized, because or new parks that are near completion, and development. And I don’t know, maybe we could combine that with Union reservoir or I don’t know, maybe union and that full connectivity would be its own. So maybe that’s three and then four would be some kind of visit to our battle or somewhere else to kind of compare to see something that you can’t do on our site. Makes sense. So I can always go to apex. But if we were gonna go to apex, which I think it’s valuable I want to see a side of it and talk to people, I wouldn’t be able to. Yeah, does that make sense? I, I don’t need to go to all the parks because they’re ideal, you know what I need, but I need to go to the parks with like the I, sometimes I like to see something that we can’t do on our own. Because I feel like as our committee, we should be making an effort to get to a part of any any preferences. I mean, I can offer all these to,

Unknown Speaker 50:29
it feels like there’s a little early to the beaten up with the timeline of everything. So that could happen in the future.

Unknown Speaker 50:38
Start getting some information that maybe

Unknown Speaker 50:40
were anywhere near designed for reps that are

Unknown Speaker 50:43
up for the whole day, or maybe

Unknown Speaker 50:51
five to eight hours instead of our meeting, I think

Unknown Speaker 50:57
what I felt like last year, and this might be only when I went gone to it was valuable that you know, you can do these places, because it was done. But for like something to go through and say, Hey, see brings properties over here. And we have to work with them. And this neighborhood is for the neighborhood wants when you just talk about the Amino Gala. I just like to fit in there for 10 years. Why don’t we have a park here? It’s like, well, we got these parts moving. There’s all these other players that are involved in the new to another place. Yeah, that seems like you have to wait until we acquire something. And then there’s this whole other thing and you kind of put more of these areas and clarifies

Unknown Speaker 51:34
that you have the expert there. Yeah, you’re getting more than just here’s a part, right?

Unknown Speaker 51:41
Yeah, that’s me the union reservoir combined with that sort of larger build out plan and sparkling connectivity to the park. And since

Unknown Speaker 51:54
we do like to talk to Danielle because we do have we’re down to our final couple of options. We’ll be taking you out to the public for the final connection from sandstone ranch out to the state park that’s rare that people don’t get to probably get out to that area and look at that so we can do that is after a month

Unknown Speaker 52:13
or two and you said no, I can’t go to you. Yes. We can’t do on our own right here like you know,

Unknown Speaker 52:25
and then we can maybe come up on the by the New Adam dairies that talk about how it fit into the kind of Northern we could be able to make that happen as well. Well, wherever you choose, very good

Unknown Speaker 52:42
sounds that I would be interested in that union.

Unknown Speaker 52:47
We’ve been talking about that a lot over the past year. I mean, that’s between this group and Dan Wolford, you know, open space that that all has come into play a lot. Yeah, new

Unknown Speaker 52:57
to spring Gulch like well, phase two,

Unknown Speaker 53:00
just got to wear three will go out and underneath the railroad

Unknown Speaker 53:05
tracks for 15 years and gone nowhere. You just go under, I can look back up onto the highway.

Unknown Speaker 53:16
So now the harder question is you do you set up our meeting? We need to do it sooner rather than later because we’re peak light is this evening. Okay, so we did in

Unknown Speaker 53:37
August. I think we ended up biting the clock. So actually, it

Unknown Speaker 53:43
was my anniversary last August because everybody left early August

Unknown Speaker 53:52
arguing Nord eighth. Yeah. That’s Monday in August. Gotcha. That’s how we got a glimpse. Yes.

Unknown Speaker 54:07
No, it sounded like we’re in August. Okay, well, let’s pending conversation with staff. Okay, let’s just say tentatively obviously good that works.

Unknown Speaker 54:27
Yeah, work with Dan and Danielle and yes this is the look at

Unknown Speaker 54:42
okay. Now, I answered staff and the other items. Good. I’m good. For now Question. No,

Unknown Speaker 55:03
I have a few Believe it or not. You want to go first? I have answered your question

Unknown Speaker 55:11
vandalism, slaps misuse, it was people probably too large adult you said ever like using those what happens when we get at larger weight on it slams the other end and stops quick. So the wheels are damaged. So we have the new wheels on order. So, so it is gonna be it will be fixed. And I don’t know how we keep it from happening at the end. But it’s just a major element of the whole park. It was simply if we invested in that design, we need to be prepared to maintain it. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 55:36
it’s the biggest thing that Exactly, yeah. Okay, I got so many other questions. Okay. All right. Can I guess? So my first one is rant. These are all just random questions. I noticed just that when I was investigating button rock that it seems that you can enter the park at 3am. And I’m curious, is that really true? And if so, why is that so different from all these other hours.

Unknown Speaker 55:59
So button rock is a unique property, it’s it’s a water is versus water funds, it’s really considered to be mentioned others other parks and can’t use and we’ll be the first to tell you it’s not hard to preserve. So we really pursue that property to sell water on. But knowing in that area, we have that unique foothills ecosystem.

Unknown Speaker 56:19
I mostly want to know who goes the 3am or so

Unknown Speaker 56:21
projects is that so that’s exactly at what the reasons we really didn’t master plan. It’s like historical abuses up there. We’re trying to make sure that we can accommodate that make sure we meet the needs of the wildlife preserve and the water quality up there. And that was can use as always peace if people want to get up and be fishing on the backside of the reservoir at 6am when the sun came up or at five, you’d have to moving in like at three o’clock from down below to be up there. So that was one of the reasons that we did not have the same hours on that. That property as we did with them to parse it out.

Unknown Speaker 56:55
I wasn’t trying to hurt gotcha. I was shy about it. People go at 3am Yeah, it

Unknown Speaker 56:59
really was it was the real thing is you actually we were working long term on some better ways of doing this but you start up at Johnny park and you can hike down and through and into lions Actually Actually you can do come down through go up sleepy lining or the whole ranch so there’s a lot of people to do camping a Forest Service and they’re moving through and stuff so there’s quite a bit like that ability to to

Unknown Speaker 57:23
park down the lake and back just did. Well, it’s actually Coulson Gulf Shores. Yeah. It was so a half mile long trip, Philly.

Unknown Speaker 57:38
So my other question, actually, David, I already emailed about this, but it was interesting. And I thought I thought I’d bring it up because I have a colleague at work who lives here that desolate who said, Hey, Jeff, I know you’re on the board tell me when I professionally it’s gonna get filled, because I want to use it in the waters too. So I emailed David and asked, and you told me because it can give me information I’ve never even thought about which I thought maybe it was the board would be interested in I looked online, I couldn’t find it. But the short version was I had no idea that there was this prioritization process of what gets filled when it’s based on when it joined the system. And you got I thought that was super cool. And I knew nothing about it. I’m just saying, Hey, guys, this is cool if you don’t know about it, cuz I just have this long email that has like a listing of 1910 when we took on Macintosh, and the week before we apparently took on unions and unions before Macintosh. So sorry, intro, I’d have

Unknown Speaker 58:29
sure that there’s that much detail line. But you know, can you sit in West AWS if we want presentation, I’m really what that is, is prior corporations. Where are you from? Jeff originally, I grew up in Dallas, in Dallas. And I’m from Michigan. So in Michigan, we have a small Spring Hill Farms and we try to get water off our farm all the time. In Colorado, how you have water on it, and every drop of water is really owned by somebody and they have a right to that first in time first and right. And yes, if you have a priority, you can have water coming right past your reservoir and your farm as someone downstream has a older right on that water use have to watch that water go by. And by time you get a priority, it may have all dried up and there’s no water coming down. So you’ve got to watch lots of water but why not have a opportunity to take that Macintosh is pretty low on that. However, just today we actually had our meeting because of this really warm weather. Unfortunately, the snow is melting out really fast. I mean those those are those snow packs up in the mountains are our biggest reservoirs and people sometimes don’t realize that those are our biggest reservoirs. And when they melt out fast and we get a lot of water coming down high on did jump in Lyons is the one that divert they can sweep the whole creek you can actually walk another Creek and Highland ditch can take a while until they build the reservoirs. We actually didn’t think we have to button rock. We didn’t think we’re on full union and we definitely think we’re gonna get anything into Macintosh this last weekend in the field button off but rock is spilling and we are starting to fill union so we You may get some water into Macintosh, but it’s a really complex system. We have some amazing water resources. People that keep track of all that, that we looked at the state every day and talk about Christ in the forest piece. He’s on the phone every day and there are miles with the state engineer saying, Who’s calling for water? How much? Are we letting out? How much can we keep in and where’s it going.

Unknown Speaker 1:00:19
And it sounded very interesting. And I wanted to share. So if that’s something

Unknown Speaker 1:00:23
that you’d like to hear that more than half or I don’t think it can do half our presentation, but I have our presentation, we could probably do something on it because it really does impact our parks. And how we do our wall. One thing see if we’re committed to is using wild water to irrigate our parks. So when we build the parks, you talk to see these involves building a pond to pump out that pot, store that water and then use it for irrigating your parks. I also

Unknown Speaker 1:00:48
think the fact that some random person asked him if there may be more people in the public who wish they understood. And also so maybe it would be worth some level of communication about that kind of stuff on people can understand it.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:01
For what it’s worth, I interviewed can use in your animator, and the general manager of northern water to park series that’s available if you wanted to. I mean, it’s it’s not. It’s on YouTube, under the backstory. But we set it up pointing that when the emergency declaration occurred on the lower of a basin, swimming, that there be a fair amount of public interest, and we got what does that mean for us? And that interest has we’re going to continue to probably find that with email.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:44
Maybe we can just have it in the pocket.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:49
Or you new to the chair. Okay. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:01:54
I just think it’s interesting. color a lot of us Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:01:57
is unbelievably interesting and

Unknown Speaker 1:02:00
crazy and complicated. And complicated.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:03
needs to be revised. And it certainly is.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:07
The thing that Ken gave me was really cool, because it showed the percentage of fill of everything and it showed the hierarchy of everything.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:14
What really helps us going into the museum and doing the thing about a should revise it for water law. It’s coming up Yes. Person with water lines. So you can’t take that water. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:29
And I always said I wanted to leave early, but I have to keep going other people

Unknown Speaker 1:02:38
do it. So just question for David. De la, like we talked forever ago about the DDA and the Rangers having authority or not having authority in the DDA. And I don’t know where that went. The question just came up today from from bicycle people on dismount zones. And Baldwin Downtown Development Authority for the end. So since you’re going to be here, yeah, that’d be easier than let’s fix the third up and like our main Right, yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:03:10
so their authority really isn’t in public lands in those public lands two years ago, may have been we included the breezeways and some of those little parks by the church and stuff down there, including public lands. So as Rangers are doing patrol on a bike and they’re moving from Collier Park, and then going to Roosevelt and they come through those those breezeways a lot of people that we meet and have conversations with their camping along the Creator bad behaviors in the in the restrooms, or camping in the in the breezeways it losses have some sort of continuity and how contact with people are talking to them. So it was a piece of work with the DDA on how we could make that more a part of what the Rangers were doing, but it really does end there. We haven’t figured out a way to do the sidewalks up front. So Kimberly, I think is working on getting an ambassador out there. And these were things that again, if a ranger is down at areas and ride their bike down the street and you know give a warning or conversation or ask and being in uniform can maybe help with that. It’s just I don’t know the probability of that happening was that we will not be out there patrolling that area because it really is not a part of their area. They have jurisdiction over

Unknown Speaker 1:04:30
the back feet there were four containers earlier for the cash now there’s only two since last two weeks for filling

Unknown Speaker 1:04:52
I got some things to YouTube, David and Barbapapa tests and put The Law sounds like you guys had meetings it was civil. Jeff and you know, they feel positive like oh we’re gonna make some compromises so wherever you said was

Unknown Speaker 1:05:10
goodness, but we haven’t brought the two groups together. Met with football folks okay now with a lot of folks when we met with LTA

Unknown Speaker 1:05:21
I got the impression LTA and pickleball. Did talk separately from YouTube and Oh, yes. Yeah, that’s the impression I got anyway. And I also got positive feedback from several people about the new backboard carpark that that Patsy, the woman who came talk to us a year and a half ago, yeah, she bought doughnuts and drinks for the guys who are installing and she was so appreciative. But I got lots of complaints because of the heat about no shade at Quail. We had two years ago, I want to know those sale things. I wonder if that could happen again. Or if there’s budget for that, you know what I mean? Just those kind of trying to leave candidacy it just, you know, I think the water goes through, but you know, the sun gets dappled underneath because it’s, you know, the leagues, there’s, you know, 20 people plus, you know, from teams there. You know, between the two courts in the backside, you guys had stuff strong, or maybe LTA did

Unknown Speaker 1:06:25
say, I guess exactly as well. Is

Unknown Speaker 1:06:28
that something you knew that knew? I mean, I keep asking about a shelter, right? That’s not happening anytime soon. But this was maybe this is something we had during the Ambu. I don’t know. I mean, those nice windscreens are they all back up. I guess in the winter, when we don’t have them. That’s what we don’t need as the problem. We need them all at the same time. Let’s see if you can share but it doesn’t work either windscreens in the summer and you need the overhead so that’s fine.

Unknown Speaker 1:07:11
I got more. And the ruins then. I’m looking at the website that I wanted to learn more about but again, and I noticed it doesn’t completely make sense to me. So I just want to clarify there things on here that end up parks open space and trails section of the Longmont Colorado. gov website. It lists but rock and then right below it says like disc golf and that’s a dog parks, and this is pickleball courts, but it never mentioned tennis courts. And it never mentions basketball courts never mentions like roller hockey. And I think it seems really random. And I guess I’m just wondering, is there a different place where someone would learn about the resources that someone in the city of Longmont? Where are you at a lot of Longmont, Colorado website, directory of parks and trails. And that’s why it’s strange that Pickleball is in there first for the first playthrough of it.

Unknown Speaker 1:08:01
So you can I think when things in it, this is

Unknown Speaker 1:08:04
a piece where we have to interface with others, right? You’re not taking the website, right? We worked with that. But I think there’s a spot on there. Because I was with this other day,

Unknown Speaker 1:08:12
you should do a filter those so that way it allows you to do you can go to a park that has pickleball courts, you can go to a park that has tennis courts, and that’s where it should be able to like

Unknown Speaker 1:08:23
if I have maybe that’s just another part of the website. But this is just seems weird because I was expecting things like punk rock, right? And then I thought Pickleball is illegal. But tennis isn’t there. It just seems odd that you’d be listing some of our resources, but not all of them in

Unknown Speaker 1:08:36
that now there are each park is mostly separately with the amenity and that it has

Unknown Speaker 1:08:41
this must be a different section because this is more focused on parks, open space and trails. That’s why it’s strange to pickleball. There

Unknown Speaker 1:08:49
it is. In one of the things I think is you look at websites one is keeping them up to date on new stuff, right getting rid of stuff as it becomes irrelevant. So

Unknown Speaker 1:09:01
again, just fine. I was just surprised to see all that. And that was weird.

Unknown Speaker 1:09:06
Find that there are a number of I mean, I know it’s not your department, but aspects of the city website that are not very

Unknown Speaker 1:09:14
well they had an RPO for a marketing manager and website manager for quite some time. So anyway,

Unknown Speaker 1:09:23
I understand we offered a job and the person ended up turning it down oh

Unknown Speaker 1:09:35
so I have people talking to me asked me about dark sky areas and what would it be dark sky areas and if there is any chance of having dark side of city blackouts during migration periods. Birds don’t even know there’s a dark place you want one person work I mean, I mean, yeah, like sandstone Theosophic, sandstone things like that practice you’re just talking about museum about you know doing an astronomy program. There’s like what used to be within the city in sandstone has a crush on any Dutch sure most just I mean you can see the shipping on five miles like the the lights watching five miles away.

Unknown Speaker 1:10:24
And things definitely have wrapped around that union if you start looking at the open space program is done basically from Cairo, union reservoir to all those water properties for expansion to open space out to basically need high school. That’s going to be for a while. But again, the areas we can’t protect out there, those are going to become subdivisions to the north of those properties to Okay, so you knew

Unknown Speaker 1:10:47
right now it’d be a dark, dark. That’s why so many overhead lights that you Yeah, yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:10:53
the reason that’s the reset, then we’ll jump and say this is a stopgap measure the definition of dark sky is because again, I the the place, probably the most of these non lights can be out around that area, if you’re going to go out on those, those comparable city on properties out in WorldCat in Rowhani.

Unknown Speaker 1:11:11
With you would have to like home ponds that are back there. Or if the West End, you’re almost almost like you can get

Unknown Speaker 1:11:27
right by it. And then like the there’s

Unknown Speaker 1:11:35
an error, you’re robbing the space

Unknown Speaker 1:11:36
areas that are you know, but that’s sanctuary, state. Executive close. Yeah, highways just like it’s just

Unknown Speaker 1:11:48
a group you’re working with it could get I mean, the pieces go remind you again, hours if it’s one hour after sunset or Islamic clock that we just need to make sure that if it’s a group permitted the other news Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:11:58
and this people just also want to know, just because they want to, I mean, there’s that, that people just want to know, there’s a dark sky place that they can just go see like the proceeds or whatever. And right now, it doesn’t seem to be and then I people will talk about the migration paths that are that are affected by why and I don’t know that the idea that maybe the city could shut off the lights. Shut up lights twice a year. Yeah. Kind of cool, actually. But I doubt what’s going to happen, but so good ideas. Check them out. I know that there’s a museum, you’re talking about an astronomer called to do astronomy program. And then Frank Chapman, question mark. How’s the drive traffic going? The Bullfrog traveling? Yeah, I don’t know.

Unknown Speaker 1:12:58
Recently, but I think it’s going fairly well. I mean, that that’s been a significant piece of work Scott and his group have been trying to do to protect our native frogs. So I

Unknown Speaker 1:13:07
personally wish it wasn’t happening by the museum, because I take kids out to catch frogs there. And that’s the nature experience. And they’re the best. Cool bomber, but there are there’s a vernal pond right by there. of native frogs. That’s pretty nearby that is slated for development. Oh, well, okay. Yeah. Yeah. I brought it up to city to individuals like martial art. And I thought that after we’re

Unknown Speaker 1:13:39
over by the museum, yeah, it’s

Unknown Speaker 1:13:41
north and west of the museum. There’s a vernal pond and there should be right now as we speak. It should be close. I haven’t looked at it this year because everybody lives

Unknown Speaker 1:13:56
on the city property though. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:13:59
well. Hotel, I think it’s gonna be a road that goes it’s gonna be I’m gonna tell her about without requiring mitigation.

Unknown Speaker 1:14:17
I mean, that’s why I’ve made my note here is that we use if there is a wetland there, if there’s

Unknown Speaker 1:14:24
so who do I send the pictures of those crops to that I go to next week with kids? And I see that I like because that’s, I send them to Colorado Parks and Wildlife. This is a problem. They’re not home

Unknown Speaker 1:14:36
frog. So send them to me and I’ll give them to you. So Scott severs is my wildlife biologist would be the best person to do that too. Who’s got severs the animal for a beaver deceiver. Yeah, yes. So Scott severs Jim Couric Dan Wahlberg myself if this wasn’t the activator concert people that were the names

Unknown Speaker 1:14:56
Yeah, if you go two weeks later, you don’t even know there was on there. Yes.

Unknown Speaker 1:15:07
Just wondering since Mr. Waters wasn’t here, when we had the point where we wished he was here, should we circle back and tell them what people from this group were thinking about the combining of the Rec Center. And we want to say that

Unknown Speaker 1:15:20
I’m going to lie to you, I apologize.

Unknown Speaker 1:15:23
We wished he was here. And now he’s here. So I’m just gonna get back to that when we’re done.

Unknown Speaker 1:15:30
But yeah. Any other items on the floor? Okay, great. Well, I think we would also love to hear so Jeff gave us an overview of what was being proposed and what wasn’t, or potentially to be evaluated from the quality of life tax. And folks on the board had some questions, particularly about the inclusion of Performing Arts, which might be sort of a different animal than the other things, and you could potentially be a bit challenging for the overall approach. And we all acknowledge that

Unknown Speaker 1:16:11
that was this property versus

Unknown Speaker 1:16:16
just a general overview. So I would welcome anything else you might want to add, from your perspective.

Unknown Speaker 1:16:22
I don’t know that I have a whole lot more perspective. If you’ve heard it from Jeff, or David, I’m certainly we’re the authoritative password on this. We get to two feasibility studies that have occurred in the last 36 months, right one of the Performing Arts in one library, both lifetags library and even advanced performing arts are members of our performing arts community, our ages, move beyond the feasibility study to something right. It would result in 20th century library, a performing arts conference center. The museum has been working with consultants, they’ve done an assessment of what you know where we should go with about with expansion in New Zealand. It’s no surprise that there’s growing enthusiasm in our recreation community to revisit the what drove us to a ballot question and failed back in 2018. The need has any less today than it was then the challenge is, what’s the appetite for the amenities that would come out of this in among our voters? How elastic is the tax base? And if you if you go out this within an individual questions, four or five questions on valid, what are the chances that any one would pass? And the concern is that you you pit groups against one another? And that you did move winners and losers, right? Isn’t that in and people are gonna advocate at the expense of other other ideas or other options? That’s, that’s the worst fear. Right? The best hope we get, of course, that if you put four or five valid questions onto consulting and community, they all pass. But we couldn’t do that with one the left one question last time. He was badly we I mean, if you go back and you didn’t have your actual view on it’s a long list of mistakes that we made. We made way too long. The school district the school list wasn’t really anything behind it. I mean, there’s was a lot that was we’ve been framed all along. So so there’s no surprise we want to get back at it. I wish we’d done that correction in real time. This is a judgment politics like why do you want to go with the politics in Longmont? How deep our taxpayers want to go? And if you want to be successful and complications then with a special district that has all these different interests in it, and how do you then set priorities within the special district to make best use of the resources in it? There are huge issues that the city will have to deal with. How we fund Parks and Rec now, or how we found rec fat fund recreation now, how we fund the library, the museum, and we don’t do much with you the arts can be other than the arts public places. I would assume that those resources would still be available for recreation for the museum for the library, etc. So there’s a fairly complex set of ideas in the government and government agreements I’m gonna guess. I remember creating that you select romantic moments in your life. But at the end of the day, the concern is going at this with individual questions. You’re gonna end up losing four or A lot of questions for four or five questions or whatever, whoever marshals the best campaign at the expense of others that

Unknown Speaker 1:20:10
couldn’t appear and also be that this thing filled in all five that Oh, absolutely.

Unknown Speaker 1:20:15
I think there’s the biggest thing. Maybe nothing happened.

Unknown Speaker 1:20:18
Yeah. Now, if you had your entire recreation community, in your arts community and your library community, your friends library, were all pointed in the same direction for Kansas already. That’s, that’s the best one.

Unknown Speaker 1:20:33
The other question that again, after the article, where was the discussion about what kind of tax it would be whether it be proper? Yeah, which is?

Unknown Speaker 1:20:43
And I, I, there’s some legal questions. That I don’t know that we have answers to just yet. What are the options for fixing an ad valorem tax, or property tax with a sales tax in the same question? I don’t know if we can do that. And I don’t know. I mean, I’ve heard that question raised. I haven’t heard our city attorney give you the definitive response to that question. So I don’t know if you can mix.

Unknown Speaker 1:21:10
That’d be kind of cool, actually, because it would tax people that are on property will likely pass us people that are visiting.

Unknown Speaker 1:21:17
Well, that’s the rub on the sales tax. Right. And it’s going to impact people who can least afford it. For some of the things we tax. Can you give up or people who are traveling through online the chance to share the burden of servicing debt? Right. So that that, again, is a judgment call. I do think I think it’s a good avenue. This is kind of tangential to it. But I do think people actually, what we what we tax is a sales tax like food. This is going to call it question. If we do something like this, I don’t know that we can. We could we could add one more burden on those who are least able to afford to live in long run without making any combination of some kind. And I think the sales tax employees place to start personal.

Unknown Speaker 1:22:11
Tax caviar agree.

Unknown Speaker 1:22:13
Wow. Yeah. There’s the idea of electric tax in it along with sales tax property tax is something that you would amp up the tax on luxury items. So it’s a ledger, I have a model automobiles and things like that. But but those are, those are legal questions that I don’t have.

Unknown Speaker 1:22:41
I mean, it’s an interesting idea. I am not a marketing expert, but I would probably not call it quality blackcaps For too long, because I feel like that’s I mean, arts activities district. Yeah, I mean, you know, something, I think, especially with the inflation and gas, like quality of life tax seems unnecessary. And

Unknown Speaker 1:23:02
counting this is the European will be a challenge. One of the many challenges is going to be illegible. There’s something called BOD rolling, right, that is prohibited from a municipality or group of elected body wanting to put a tax question on the ballot, you can’t roll multiple initiatives into the same question. So you got to frame the question large enough to accommodate accomplish what it is you want to accomplish. So a couple of years ago, when we passed a the the dedicated sales tax for updating the city of the civic plaza Civic Center, the museum and fire stations and the justice and the sprinkler system for golf last. We had to do that as three separate questions. And personally, I was just certain, I mean, I wanted all those fast, but I thought the one that had the least chance of passing was going to be the recreation. Fortunately, it passed. And I was I was lobbying to roll these all up into one question. And I was told we can’t because there’s just all against log rolling. And that’s what that would be. And we couldn’t frame but we didn’t work hard enough to frame that question, ways that you could work to put all those questions and all those initiatives into one ballot question. So it was new when I heard Harold talk about quality of life tax. It’s the first time I’ve heard it referred to this way. We’ve been in this conversation and kind of on the fly about what a special district might include. Cultural District or civic district, and then I heard quality of life gesture. I got my own concerns about up about the bat label. But I do think some some marketing some market research has to be done. Yeah, I guess you could walk into the same bus that you did with the

Unknown Speaker 1:25:16
quality of life tax. I mean, if I could really break it down quality of life is what it’s about. And that actually I’ve got an email on board with giving us a good quality of life. Quality of Life fund, rather than quality of life tax. Yeah. Yeah, this Yeah. I mean, they’re, they’re a marketing professional, Fun. Fun, fun. I mean, I, again, I think it’s an interesting idea that I think, you know, we learned from the pool and ice that language really matters, in my mind. And but I, you know, I would hate to see this sale,

Unknown Speaker 1:25:53
because language of messaging is a campaign who, who are your opinion leaders in town that you’d like to have on board? I mean, there’s so much work that needs to be done. That wasn’t done right in the run up to that. So was it worth it? Okay, anything? are meeting your timeline. Okay. Okay. Motion to adjourn. Second. All right.

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