Library Board Meeting – April 11, 2022

Video Description: Library Board Meeting – April 11, 2022

Note: The following is the output of transcribing from a video recording. Although the transcription, which was done with software, is largely accurate, in some cases it is incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or [software] transcription errors. It is posted as an aid to understanding the proceedings at the meeting, but should not be treated as an authoritative record.

Read along below or follow along here:

Unknown Speaker 0:00
So, let’s just go right let’s Why don’t you just start off? Yeah, and we’ll follow it.

Unknown Speaker 0:07
Okay, yeah. And I apologize, I’m looking at these different settings for video, why my camera’s not working, it shouldn’t be working.

Unknown Speaker 0:17
That’s okay, we have some, we have some in case I made paper copies of the latest version that you sent me.

Unknown Speaker 0:26
So we’re able to share my screen at least, okay? Otherwise, we’re able

Unknown Speaker 0:31
to follow up paper and we have to turn it back on, you

Unknown Speaker 0:40
create a sharing. So it looks like everything’s taken a sideboard. So I will just jump in and say, I’m not going to go through the entire slide deck. And like, it was really the preference. The first several slides are really a couple of things. One is to context that around what we’re presenting to council, and you know, what the project is, and a lot of this will go through very quickly, it’s just in case there’s a council member, you know, I know you have to do council members and support the project initiated. And so giving them just a chance to know sort of what is the scope of work? And what is the purpose here? That’s similar thing with, you know, giving them the background on what analysis has been completed today. And you know, these are the feasibility studies are really tricky, because it’s hard to know, how to tie all the things like collagen agement. So I just want people to understand for this is a planning level exercise, we’re trying to, you know, understand this from a feasibility perspective. And certainly, I think we expect that there will be additional public engagement or, you know, if the city were to move forward with something like a bong, that’s the stage at which we will be asking the public to know, so having to really understand the scope of work is for their benefit. Not not necessarily completely to cover in depth, but it’s just really to have it in the slide deck. several slides. After that, I think up to maybe slightly, maybe like slide 24 are just good situation assessment. So a couple of weeks ago, you all have read, for the most part, the situation assessment, I do want to make a couple of notes of some content in the presentation, because based on your feedback, and just based on the points communicate clearly to counsel, I added a couple of exhibits. And it’s really there’s no new information contained in this presentation. But there are some places where I’ve updated exhibit to dig in a little bit more deeply. A great example of that. And let me see right click a slide is around expenditures and slide 15. So if you look at slide 15 is in the operational assessment section, let me see if I can get this.

Unknown Speaker 3:00
Why it’s not, that’s okay. We’ve got it, we’ve got it here.

Unknown Speaker 3:04
So this exhibit was not critically in a situation assessment, I’ve now added it to the situation assessment. But essentially, as you’ll see later in the presentation, I think it’s really useful to understand how long multiple libraries that sort of fits into a broader sort of peer group. Because we do have this offline 16, where we look at where the library fits in amongst all the libraries, you know, that’s really helpful. But then it’s also like, let’s put this into context, what are your peers actually spending on library services. And I will just say, you know, this becomes very helpful later, as we look at the actual what would it cost to deliver the preferred level of service, because you can see that it’s very much in line with what your peer libraries are spending. A couple of notes here is, you know, something that is topping on August, when you look at this, this chart is presented from the largest peer library to the smallest. So online is close to the smallest in terms of library service area. And I saw when I looked at this, one of the things that became really clear to me is that the library’s sort of taking a step up in terms of who its peer group is. So you’re now starting to plant a finger sandbox that you would have, you know, even 10 years ago, or 15 years ago, because as you grow, you’re gonna be in a much larger state. And you’re the type of urban environment where people are expecting a higher level of urban services. So that’s why you know, a lot more public libraries have been very explicit in my sort of overview of institutions. This is the largest library that will have one outlet. I think a lot of that students are getting into this kind of bigger sandbox where these larger library systems are either serving larger communities or they’re not physical libraries. So there’s a couple other exhibits I would say a review. Or at least like, I’m calling them out that I did call out in our previous presentation. Another example would be I just as I was going through the level of service context, again, it’s really helpful to understand what are we actually spending on collections, historically. So that’s why that exhibit has been called out. And then one other peer exhibit that’s new is on slide 22. This is really like a background that I wanted to be able to provide the numbers to back up two claims. One is that we have a high number of visits for open network, but a relatively lower number of visits per capita. And then what does that look like for our peers? A claim that we’re making in the situation assessment is that there’s a strong correlation between library visits for over an hour. And there’s likely unmet demand for library hours, because and that’s why our per capita visits are low is because there’s just not enough hours. So I wanted to have the numbers. Council’s preference preferences to have just a 15 to 20 minute presentation, and so on, some of these slides are will be saved as little as you know, here’s some background data that support some of the points I’ve taken the next couple of slides. And so we won’t necessarily go through each of these things, or metrics in detail. But that way, if someone asks a question like, well, you know, what about Westminster Public Library? How many outlets do they have? If you go back to slide 22, we’ll see that they have that detail provided in the slide deck. So I did also add miscellaneous and I talked about it a little bit via email. And it’s kind of a takeaway slide, a question that goes to Sarah and Ronnie. And Mark has to be sort of like what was my sort of couple sentences takeaway from the study. And I really want to make sure that we’re being very clear about what the takeaways are here, which is that there’s very high quality library services being delivered. And in terms of the best of the resources available, the library is performing very well. But you know, there’s limitations to what can be provided within existing resources. I also think it’s really helpful to reiterate the point that library expenditures have been decreasing over time. So you know, the library has been really forced to do more with less over the last several years. And that’s a big challenge. Even if you don’t want to get into what your higher level services look like. The library simply cannot continue to provide the same level of service with fewer and fewer resources at a certain point, you just cannot be creative and efficient enough to do that. So I want councils to know that this is really at a critical juncture. So that’s the takeaway slide after that.

Unknown Speaker 8:01
But I think we wanted to cover with you all tonight. But I’m gonna pause there and see if there’s any questions before

Unknown Speaker 8:07
any skeptics brought up a good point? Because you and I have talked about tipping points before? And you know, that’s, that’s the question, I guess, are we already there? Are we at that tipping point? Are we past the tipping point? You are? So?

Unknown Speaker 8:21
Yeah, you see, I feel like you’re the slide deck?

Unknown Speaker 8:24
I answered. I think you kind of I think you kind of do I just want you to keep that. That kind of question. Comment in mind.

Unknown Speaker 8:31
Yeah. And honestly, I uncomfortable thinking are at that tipping point. And that’s one of the reasons what you’ll find in the financial analysis is that we have what I call option zero, which is a no action alternative, which what would it cause the city to continue to make a different level of service, which are positioning is not an option, it’s not an option. Because there’s things that you don’t have as a library to deliver this level of service. But that option is presented there. The reason for that is to show what is the delta between what we need to maintain an actual baseline and what we’re setting. So that’s the reason that options in there, and I think that the presence of that option is should communicate that continuing on in this simple, alright, so I will think about the takeaway slide. I don’t know that. I’ll think about whether we want to update that language. But I also think that that’s something that should be in my comments is like, the library cannot continue to library services.

Unknown Speaker 9:38
It’s absolutely true. And it’s true already. And then I’m looking at we’re looking at answers on city council tomorrow night, they’ll vote on whether or not to increase minimum wage. We have a bunch of animal shelters that are making 12 Something an hour that will probably go up to 5050 that that that we run into when we get the city is not calling compassion. I’m calling to Actually, because we’re not running into, that’s when you run into the next level of wages. And we aren’t overlapping, but the the duties of the next level are all customer service based and the duties of our minimum wage books are not. So I think there should be a bigger space. So were there all kinds of things now that we’re already running into. So I think that’s a good point to, to make that, you know, the more we I’m not opposed to people getting paid better for what they’re doing. But if it’s not coupled with the other folks above them also receiving, consequently better pay for what they’re doing, then you end up with trouble. And then you end up with fewers, you know, you end up with, do you end up with the same amount of money, then you end up with fewer staff members who doesn’t work. So I think we’re already there. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 10:46
You know, I do something to be aware of that in the analysis. The analysis is predicated on existing salary schedule, positions, like using the highest end of the city salaries. But it doesn’t mean that you can’t pay beyond the salary schedule. So that’s true, you find that you’re going to be using in the short term or the near term, that due to whatever factor in the great resignation or just a general lead, and we’re going to be punishing the sitting applicant freeze that salary schedule, we certainly could include a contingency, or we could model it with those higher wages.

Unknown Speaker 11:26
I don’t think that’s gonna happen. Any of that in the near future. They’re doing some job audits, but I don’t think that’s going to come to anything soon. I think it’s just the minimum wage level that’s been affected.

Unknown Speaker 11:36
What’s it? What do you mean by contingent, the

Unknown Speaker 11:40
contingency? Like, it’s very common and feasibility analysis to say that this could, you know, this estimate, but it could be up to 10%. Higher, and, you know, put a contingency on it just like you would a construction project. Yeah. That’s totally common. So we could include some kind of range. Based on things like, you know, I put in a slide deck. And I think it’s very important for us to remember that our analysis is based on today’s market conditions, and historical rents. And our working conditions are changing very rapidly. Right now, we are seeing extremely high, much higher inflation that we’ve seen over the historical period. Irregular the day resignation is a potentially a major change. And in the labor market, there’s lots of things that could go the other way. And I expect some kind of correction in our economy every seven to 10 years, has been historically what our minute looks like we’ve not had a correction going on. So it’s just really, really important to remember that a feasibility study is only as good as inputs. And the inputs right now are based on a really high growth economy. With low inflation and those types of things.

Unknown Speaker 13:06
Absolutely terrible.

Unknown Speaker 13:08
If you considered adding a risk, slide to your presentation. What do you mean? So that the, here’s your base analysis, whatever you come up with, and then you have a slide that says here are risks to the space analysis patient? One worse would be inflation continues.

Unknown Speaker 13:33
Yeah, so the risk analysis is on slide 30, whatever it is, is wonderful. That big limitation Yes. That is.

Unknown Speaker 13:57
Got our next step.

Unknown Speaker 14:00
Now see limitations.

Unknown Speaker 14:02
Okay, so we might need that. So that’s really weird.

Unknown Speaker 14:12
Okay, so So the limitations is going to be pretty much what we were just talking about that.

Unknown Speaker 14:17
Yeah, absolutely. So yep. It basically said what I was just saying about the great resignation was named systemically in there inflation rates were

Unknown Speaker 14:28
no so so where my head was at, I mean, those are good risk things. But, you know, another risk might be delay. You know, if you delay making a decision on this and you try and make it three years down the road that would cost you a wheel that’s shot. That

Unknown Speaker 14:54
let’s, let’s come back to this. The question I’m going to ask Just a minute. But my hesitation with decision making right now is that we’re not actually asking counsel, at least from my perspective, current, she’s asking counsel for a decision. And at this meeting, what we’re asking for is to review. The initial results tell us if they need to, they need to alter the analysis so that they have an outcome. So for example, like, and they look at it, and like, we would never spend more than, you know, 15%, on labor services, or whatever it was, that we’re looking for that sort of feedback from them was the final option, which would be steering committee go back first and come back with their preferred option. They’re able to do that. So I’m not against including Chris, Shawn, two limitations to the analysis. But I also want to do that thoughtfully about around what are we actually doing and I would argue that our position is that if they delay this library might or in the library board might choose to pursue a district model. And so just so you know, as a camera,

Unknown Speaker 16:27
just to follow up on some of those points in it, I understand your your point where you say, You’re not asking for a decision in this meeting. But I think it’s important in helping your audience understand what concerns you have, with the data in the study? Not necessarily it’s not put together correctly, but here are the risks that you have come across or you’ve, you’ve thought about as you put this study together? And I would say inflation is one I would say, delay is one, I would say, you know, with the labor market is are there enough, you know, capable people coming into the labor market to satisfy this? Man there are, this is a very dynamic time that we’re in. And I don’t think it’s, I think it’s unfair to at least point out to your audience, some of those risks,

Unknown Speaker 17:39
but the great resignation, and that is affecting it hasn’t affected us yet, directly, but it is affecting a lot of librarian and a lot of library directors, because people are often now choosing to do something else other than face to face customer service. Because you’re after being really scared from the pandemic, you know, a lot of folks are thinking, Well, gosh, if I could do a job instead, where I could work at home and not be forced to work on this public service desk and be exposed to pandemics, that would be a good thing. So we are getting some of that. And we are seeing some of that as we survey staff has to do a step request more and more, you know, what can I do? How much can I work at home? But can I drop desk and our answers are not much for a lot of staff. Because if your job is to do face to face customer service, it’s hard for you to do at home. How much of that is burnout, though? I think some of it is that we don’t you don’t end up you know, libraries. Traditionally, good libraries don’t end up with a lot of books, maybe because of burnout. People let people stay a long time. Yeah, but we just had a pandemic, which is more retirements, definitely we’re seeing you a greater, you can increase the people often either people work realizing that 84 years old. So so you’re not seeing that anymore. People are retiring when they retire when they’re able to retire.

Unknown Speaker 19:05
So. So I think that we have plenty of critics out there that will assign risk to your work. So I wouldn’t worry about that. But as the creator of the study, I think you have an insight in terms of things that she thought about if you were putting the numbers together that you said, hey, you know, this, I’m making this assumption, but you know, this could go the other way on me and that may change the study in this direction. So I wanted your help and understanding.

Unknown Speaker 19:40
Maybe we should maybe we only have a half an hour left or we can make we can continue to move through any anything. We’ll think about those

Unknown Speaker 19:47
questions. Okay. Yeah, that’s great. Okay, so I do just, you know, we will at least put some kind of limitations slide back in here. And I think this idea of this being a point in time Now says that we were at a critical juncture where it is expected to do this. But, you know, if Library’s funding were to degrade, or you know, there’s always things that can happen that will make it more challenging. So that’s great. I also, just on that note, you know, I think what’s happening in older could influence pictured here, just because an example. That is there, so I’ll put that in there for sure. The next section of the slide deck, though, after the situation assessment, is really around, setting the library board around the setting level service standards, I wanted to sort of put in this idea of fire service and not just believer from the steering committee, everything that you don’t really like this hygiene prioritizing sunrise plus, of what was in the communities, for TVA, as well, as, you know, in the full sort of survey data than the older interviews we did. So, you know, when I say this is a summary of things that came up thematically, like everything that every single person said, I guess, somewhere in there somewhere to display a dog park to the library or something, you know, one off things that we’ve heard, but it’s been adequate, these are the things that the community needs and desires from its library. We’ve refined this list. The idea here is to communicate why we need more library services, and what would be done with those services to not just the quantitative, this is what more library services look like. We also set some standards. So you know, one of the things that’s really challenging about library services is that you do a lot of different things, which are also easily quantified. And they also are interrelated. And so we have to set some high standards that will help sort of that, what will we be buying these dollars if we were to expand services. And the key indicators or metrics are collection spending, library outlets and library hours. One thing that I’ve heard from Nancy that I have not updated yet, but the baseline maybe should be 65 hours a week, that would make more sense with your current schedule. The baseline could be anything. So if you want to point four, seven library services. This is really just about responding to what the community’s needs and desires are. So I have put in 64, Nancy suggested 65. Slides. But if you all discuss this user lifespan, what we really want is, you know, 10 hours, seven days a week, the 40 hours per week is similarly just that is just an additional thought. This is based on the idea that you know, your branches, you might have a more limited schedule that more closely matches, you know, people’s like, out of school and weekend routines, you might have like morning space in which humans can take times. Again, I just looked at some example libraries in Colorado, you can tell me any number here, what I will say the number of hours for branches does affect our staffing Hall. Sure. And it does affect variable costs related to operating the library. So I just, if you change these numbers, they will change the projected cost. baseline for

Unknown Speaker 23:43
me, that’s something we’ve talked about the snap a lot is that interconnectedness of all of this because we know that we’re low on our staffing FTE, we know that we need more staffing, like yesterday, but we have no place to put anybody. So that’s that’s one of those things where I’m thinking, Oh, we have just not branches with with some decent staff space, we have to be having some staff, we literally don’t have room to put one more body. So

Unknown Speaker 24:07
yeah, so yeah, those are all important things to think about. So you know, where the, you know, just, you know, like some of these numbers should just come out of thin air. They’re based on the discussions we had I also where it was possible, looked at, you know, the 50th percentile, the 75th percentile for all all Colorado libraries. So that 650 per capita in that $10 per capita represent the 50th percentile, the 75th percentile, respectively, is for all vulnerable libraries, that maybe too much too little. I don’t know. You know, you can think about what you want those numbers to be, you know, the other interconnected things here with budget spending is that you have to last you have that space. And so it would be that this is great for the short term, but in the long term, you really only moralists for Capital One Have you, those are just things that you guys should all discuss. And we should figure out how to update them. That’s pretty easy. And also, you know, this is an area where you may start with a lower number with counsel. And you can always adjust up your collection spending later to relatively small.

Unknown Speaker 25:21
That’s not generally how that works. Usually, you start high, and you’re,

Unknown Speaker 25:26
like, I want suffering, look at saying that. But what I would say is that you are, in my, from my perspective, this is going to be something that you need to negotiate intensely with counsel. And if I were to make a compromise, right now, I would compromise collection spending, over getting those branches, right, if those branches, your counsels, not gonna be able to tell you that they’re not gonna sell the books and materials later, right? You’re gonna have a much stronger argument and much greater champions in the community, who are going to be able to say, hey, I want a Spanish language collection in our South Branch. And that’s a much easier conversation than coming back and saying, hey, you know, you gave us one branch, one, a third one now? Yeah. So that’s all I’m saying. I don’t mean to sound flippant when I say it, but I just, I do think, you know, even $10 per capita in election spending is a lot less than.

Unknown Speaker 26:22
That’s true. So, after a lot of service standards, to sort of like what what are the stable operating models? Or?

Unknown Speaker 26:37
Is it really feasible? Because one of the things one of the things that I really learned through this process is that there’s actually very few options for the language. There’s many expressions of the options that are available. The governance perspective, there are not a lot of things that make sense. You’re not going to be going to county library, you’re not going to be going to joint library, you don’t have a higher educational institution in Longmont that would make sense to be a partner for a joint library. It just doesn’t exist. So favoring Valley School District would be a terrible partner, even though that might be a great idea. Terrible burger, okay, they do not have the library service to their students, let alone becoming a partner. They don’t play

Unknown Speaker 27:22
a great show.

Unknown Speaker 27:23
Yeah. So

Unknown Speaker 27:25
some of these great ideas, they’re not

Unknown Speaker 27:26
just usability studies, university, Regional Library and marine. You know, one of the things that I learned from the informant interviews is that, you know, well older is working through this process on their own, there is not a big appetite for collaboration now, and I think a lot of that is, according to the Boulder County Library, they have looked at doing this a long, long, three times, and it just never has gotten off the ground, there’s not enough agreement on me and how to make that work. So I’m not going to tell you There couldn’t be a good potentially do a collaboration with an outside library. But that is outside of I think outside what we can do this feasibility study, unless we were sort of having those discussions now. And just you know, they they’ve done the study, like they did their version of the study in 2018. So it exists out there already. And they are planning on going to a ballot initiative, which is going to be really interesting to see how that lands, but I think they’re thinking November of 2022

Unknown Speaker 28:31
is about oh, yeah, we’re very well versed in what will be

Unknown Speaker 28:37
next. I would say, you know, without having to have any analysis, it’s unfortunate that there’s not an opportunity for collaboration, but I think there’s some real, really strong arguments to be made about why it doesn’t make sense.

Unknown Speaker 28:51
To me. I don’t think it’s dissimilar though to the, to the, you know, studies that we did in Bellingham, I think there’s a there’s a difference. There’s a definitely difference in communities and community mindset. You know, I think that you’re there was a good reason why, even though economically, it probably made sense that Bellingham public didn’t join the county, because the county with him just a different focus. So

Unknown Speaker 29:17
just something if I get pushed back on this council, I think something that is really important for us to point out is when you look at system level spending on that 515, again, you know, Boulder is spending at 451 per capita are both impressive options and presents lesson. So what do you want to collaborate with another library and have to spend that much when you can do it just for your own community instead of the state? So didn’t want to just ask lots of things in case we get pushback on that topic. But what this comes down to is that there’s really two governance options that makes sense here now, which is Municipal Library versus the library district. I think we did the municipal library option. There are many expressions for that. So this idea of cultural district has not been lost from the analysis. But it’s really just an expression of municipal government is not substantively, you’re not going to create a cultural war word. There isn’t a funding mechanism for that. If you were to do that you will be more likely in a library district. So that’s why it looks like your options. But as we go through our analysis, we can express these ways. The other thing is that municipal governance is good governance. Oh, there’s the guys bajillion ways to make fun. So we have looked at like one version of a funding strategy, we’re hoping the council will give us more direction about what sort of funding tools do they want us to look at? Older for example, model of Levy, a mill levy, and sales and use tax council was, was like, Yeah, we want to know sales and use tax, or we want this much property taxes from professional sales. We think we can come up with these options, button 15 different ways that we want to. So well, it’s really just more options in terms of governance model and level of service. Potentially, we could express this in many ways, once we get into once we added that layer, or how so. So the options that we are actually looking at are. So a couple of things about the the options aren’t that we’re looking at or apply for easily, that no actual alternative is we are not considering this as a sustainable operating model. They continue to pay just what they’ve been sending over the historical period, they continue that amount into the future that’s labeled the purpose of having an option zero, and that you can subtract each of the preferred options before you subtract option zero from it. And then you know, the net few dollars needed. And that will be very valuable to the city because what we want to remind them that, hey, we’re not at for $7 million. For the library, we’re asking you for an additional 3 million, you know, or whatever it is.

Unknown Speaker 32:21
So where are those numbers?

Unknown Speaker 32:22
Definitely not for this. There on slide 30. Okay. So two things. Are, there’s the operating costs for each operating model, which I guess I got a spelling error here. Sorry about that. And then there’s the actual what is the net dollars that will be needed for each option? So that, and I believe it’s a net view for the library district? Because I think one of the key questions so we’ll have a really Council of answers, if you will, after a library district option would that’s the plan exists the tax dollars for which the city continue to receive and use those tax dollars and people will be paying a very, very large new tax. And I think that’s the new challenge folder. They asked for the library district and library district has to fully fund operations. Whereas

Unknown Speaker 33:31
this is 3.9 3.9 $20 million. With a folder where the average house is $1.3 million. It’s a huge,

Unknown Speaker 33:51
the biggest, most most of the challenges of complaints that I’ve read, so far are people saying, well, no one’s told us what you’re doing with the current 11 million. So is it Are you Are we really going to be paying $31 million for the library, or what’s happening with them. So whatever happens here, I think it’s really important to specify what happens with the libraries are expected.

Unknown Speaker 34:12
Yeah, so and that’s why we look at, you know, the funding and financing strategies, what you’ll see is that, for the municipal library, we just looked at what it would cost to fund the Delta, that revenue needed to fund a library. So not the share that is already existing, but just the additional resources needed. So

Unknown Speaker 34:35
page 35 incremental numbers.

Unknown Speaker 34:41
Is that right now or even 1000?

Unknown Speaker 34:43

Unknown Speaker 34:46
Yeah, so So option four, it would be $3 million over what you’re spending now.

Unknown Speaker 34:55
We have now if you look at their actual chart, and I can do I can duplicate this too. This chart into the total

Unknown Speaker 35:08
I just didn’t understand because it wasn’t labeled.

Unknown Speaker 35:11
Yeah. So option one would be to be a baseline. We would we are short by about $180,000, which is what we thought when we first started looking at this, just to reach baseline a

Unknown Speaker 35:26
little under a million dollars,

Unknown Speaker 35:28
which is, which is what I said 800 million. Okay. That’s yeah. So in option two, yeah. Yeah. She wouldn’t be barebones library district. So 1,000,001 50. And you have preferred municipal and preferred.

Unknown Speaker 35:50
Route 3 million. So

Unknown Speaker 35:53
added on to the target.

Unknown Speaker 35:54
Yep. So we got a, we got a,

Unknown Speaker 35:57
we’ve added about eight, this is about seven. Except Amy and I were talking that we don’t, there are some classes that we don’t know yet. If we’re looking at branches, because you know, there are branches of their branches, you know, like 1200 square foot branches, I had 35,000 square foot branches. So there’s a huge difference in cost and operation. So that would have to be more specific. To get to numbers, which would make the numbers got this is this baseline?

Unknown Speaker 36:24
Yeah. And so you know, that’s, again, we want given that we’re presenting this initial picture to the council, if we want to add a contingency, or we want to adjust these up a little bit. Now, when we lose mine to do that, we can always adjust things down. I can tell you, honestly, at this stage of capital, you know, what’s important is really to show them that there’s a very, very significant difference between the baseline and the preferred, that there’s not an extreme difference between city governments versus library district. And you really have to understand that this isn’t about buying new services for local residents. This isn’t about the governance governance model is essentially just a strategy to govern and pay for reserves. Right. But what we’re really with this is really always making sure we have what we need. And you know, they’re, they can’t continue the way we’re going today. Right. And it’s show that at minimum, we have a resource, whether or not you implement that preferred level of service. I think

Unknown Speaker 37:30
that it is important to point out and like you said, I’ve been trying to try to be Switzerland through most of this. But it is important to point out that, you know, if you’re looking at City revenues, you know, revisit revenues, it would have to be there have been instances where letter is asked for additional city revenues, and you know, they’ve given and then removed. So not that dedicated directly to the library libraries often have been a part of it, but they talked about this document talked about, yes, we did work with the library. But we all see that you need to order this, this and this, and we’re going to lump it into a quality of life type chaps. And that it’s kind of arbitrary. Libraries point of view, how much of it goes to the library after?

Unknown Speaker 38:11
Well, the city is reorganizing, and you’re going to be a thing called culture and recreation. And that’s a very different structure than where you’re sitting today. And we don’t even know what that’s gonna really look like, budget wise and structure watching the city.

Unknown Speaker 38:27
Well, libraries are always kind of the odd man out there in, you know, city organizations because of not being seen as having a revenue generator, right. So it’s always difficult for libraries to be kind of in competition if you were working with revenue generating entities, because we’re the opposite. We’re trying to take away our fines and or other things that generate revenue and create inequities. So we’re at a different spot.

Unknown Speaker 38:53
Yeah. So when we met with city staff, they were all excited about how much money the golf courses are making. So

Unknown Speaker 39:02
golf is Golf was the champion champion of COVID. Like the weather. So

Unknown Speaker 39:09
I actually have a comment on the golf piece, though, because I think that they’re all excited about how much revenue goes generating, but the municipal government has had to subsidize all this capital. Right? That’s right. So it’s not fair to act like it’s fully revenue generating, enterprises being subsidized. And I would have wished that we could look at what is the net number and in their net revenue, my guess is there is not a net revenue.

Unknown Speaker 39:38
You could also use something like we have a thing called next slide here, which is an internet service in five years, that bond is paid off and, and they’re not going to lower the rates and that is about an 80 to 90% gross profit margin product. It’s going to produce 10s of millions of dollars a year of profit for the city, and they’re going to keep it so the city thinks on Clients here we have a very revenue positive city management. So they’re very aware of where, where, where they can make money. So not to, but not just, you know, doing sales tax in the usual ways, but they also look at services they can charge for. So and I think that’s good, but I also think it’s bad. The cities are not profit centers. Government should not be a province.

Unknown Speaker 40:29
Yeah, I mean, something for you all to think about is whether you have some powers of these observations to come up with something like a future like not at this stage. But at the final stage, you know, there’s a couple of things that you mentioned that you could use to create a lot of enthusiasm and energy for the library project. So culture and recreation, you know, there’s been a number of recreation facilities that looked at as a city that have not come to fruition is this time to propose that you’re going to do recreation centers with, you know, library branches of tax, like that’s an example of something that could be the next slide is another piece you want to your proposals could be like, Hey, you’re going to generate profit from next slide, that should go right back into the community, and certainly people who need Internet access who don’t have it, right, and there shouldn’t make a strong argument for some of these dollars. Something familiar, so in Washington, enterprise revenues, not government at large. So I need to look into what your

Unknown Speaker 41:38
enterprise I don’t I don’t think it benefits the government at large here, so to speak, but what we are pretty good at is sucking money away in places that wouldn’t call it hidden. But it’s definitely it’s a put in reserve, we have a lot of reserves in Longmont, we have a very conservative financial organization for city law, which has actually served us really well. Yes, and but it also means that creativity in these things is not is likely to be findable as it is in other places.

Unknown Speaker 42:15
And I’m very familiar with this community, but other communities where I’ve been where they have combined Senior Services in libraries, definitely recreation and libraries, I completely not opposed to doing that. But what almost always happens. And what’s happening here is that the library was brought in as a thought at the last minute to try and increase the positive thoughts about happy thoughts of the community, and everybody loves them. So they do but I would not be opposed to doing like a library rec center, for example. But that would be with the condition that the library is on the ground floor, the planning is not checked on the end, yes. Check on the end to get votes for something else it would have to be well thought out facility and some of the you know, I was in the planning of that when I was working in Santa Clarita. And that was a good 10 years ago. And guess what, they still haven’t built it. So it’s still being argued back and forth. And that’s 10 years that they’ve been arguing about this one. This is what center when they could have built a you know, built a branch or put a branch in a retail strip years ago.

Unknown Speaker 43:21
So yeah. So

Unknown Speaker 43:24
the harder it is. Yeah, I

Unknown Speaker 43:27
think it’s really important to be thoughtful about where your power really is here because unfortunately, you know, the city has a lot of agency in this decision. And the voters agencies are limited, you know, you ultimately if the city, you know, moves, let’s say the city is like yes, referred library model, do it. And then they don’t back that up with the dollars, you’re back in this position where you would then have to go out for that library district, although you would have probably armed and the voters may not want to do that knowing that city council might not reduce their city. Right. And so you’re in a really difficult position in terms of decision making authority.

Unknown Speaker 44:12
So, So, question is, are we gonna have another time to talk to her before City Council’s meeting? Probably because we have up to 26 Yeah. So we will be able to meet with you again, any before that.

Unknown Speaker 44:30
20 minutes. But certainly if you want more time, Nancy.

Unknown Speaker 44:37
coming in for the council meeting. Yeah, we should schedule the one right before.

Unknown Speaker 44:42
So here’s why I asked that. You know, we met with city staffs senior management, right So, and they were pretty clear that they wanted so fairly clear. But assumptions, you know, like, not just here’s some dollar amounts, I mean, you can, you can probably extrapolate out of this.

Unknown Speaker 45:09
And no consultant feasibility study in any library I’ve ever met is going to say, Okay city, you should do a district.

Unknown Speaker 45:16
But what they what they are kind of expecting is a one slide of bullet points. So that’s the whole thing. Well, that basically says, Here are your choices, without, you know, saying, here’s what you should do. But a very clear imagined Brian Bagley trying to look at this, you know, because that’s, you know, because I’m like using as an example, because he’s a skimmer, and these guys are super, super busy. And they don’t have a lot of time. So you’re better off taking this stuff and put, if you could sum it, so I don’t see a summation slide in here that makes executive query, not even executive. Not even Well,

Unknown Speaker 45:54
it’s kind of that thing at the front of your college, you know, there’s a 50 page term paper in college where you have a page and a half of what this says,

Unknown Speaker 46:02
Well, I do know, whenever whenever I started, whenever I used to start companies, I would when I’m going to talk to a venture capitalists, they are venture capitalists. That’s what city city council is, I always had, I always had a slide in there. That was very clear. Here’s what I want. Here’s what you can get, and hear the, you know, best case, worst case mill quick case type scenario,

Unknown Speaker 46:25
I still think we need the rest of it, though, for the people who do read things because like I was looking at like pool and ice and a few other things. And I’m like, well, where these numbers come from? And I don’t see the one who looks into where did you get? It happened?

Unknown Speaker 46:38
So I can I can do that. Scott, the issue, though, is that I plan to make a lot of assumptions, because right now, what this city council has not told us is whether they have a preference on how we how we would fund.

Unknown Speaker 46:53
Yeah, there’s only two choices, sales, sales tax, and property tax. And the other two choices are, that’s what they think I’m telling you what they think, Okay, this is what they told us. So and then the other two things are, we keep we keep the money that the property tax, if we go all property tax for the city, into a district. And we can we can mix and match things up. And from keeping a municipal library, we keep control of it. This is Jim golden talking. Who’s the CFO? City? City? Okay, yeah, so if he stays municipal, then it can be a mixture of property taxes, yes, if it’s going to be a district, that they’re, they’re keeping the sales tax, or you’re gonna have to raise all that money as much as that yes, property tax on. So that’s in, you know, a whole bunch of other controls. So those are really only our real choices, but they want to understand, they would like they expect this plan. This is what Harold says he expects this plan to have a fairly clear, they should be able to walk away from that presentation with a clarity of what they probably should do. And I think we’re close to that it we’re getting closer, I just I’m just I like, I like that final slide that says here’s your your choices, you know, A, B or C,

Unknown Speaker 48:15
I totally understand what you’re saying I intentionally have not put that slide into the stack, because the way this study was, is that we’re not asking counsel for their preference, we’re presenting them with the steering committee’s preference at the end of the study. So if we want to position it, as we’re asking for their reference, we certainly can do that. That’s easy to do. But it has a lot of risks attached with it. Because ultimately, what city council might say is, hey, we just want to do the baseline, and we’re gonna pay for it, they don’t have to actually dedicate any revenues to that they can just say they’re gonna pay for it and not pay for it later. And so that’s where I’m, like, really hung up on this decision making authority and power piece of this right now, the community has the power to say, We will not settle for the baseline, we want the preferred model. And if you do not do it this way, we’re just gonna go after this. And that’s what I that’s, I think the rub here is like, which way to do this process of library board and steering committee and city council to be one of those officers to sit and listen to? What if they look at them? I can, you know, option one, let’s go for baseline. And, you know, do we then for the final study that said, Our preference, the community’s preference, And option four? Or should we only be presenting options, three and four of the cases cases, they’re just going to be, you know, they just want to raise money. Should we just be presenting this as, you know, do you want to do this municipally or, let’s do the way we do municipally oral squat, this library. This is what we expect from our library.

Unknown Speaker 49:55
So we have a council number here. Yes. Why don’t we ask her But

Unknown Speaker 50:04
so I think it’s really powerful to see the full analysis is also what the recommendations are of the steering committee. So I am a reader, I sit on our bargaining team for our so I go through our NAFTA contract because we want the data for you. So I, you know, for me, I’m very detail oriented. And I know that we have other folks on council who are who are the same. So I think the one that I felt was really powerful was looking at this this semester, where how are we just how much are we putting into our library, in comparison to neighboring cities? So

Unknown Speaker 50:50
I think some of the things that she listed like that were 93rd, in funding for Canada 112 libraries in Colorado is pretty powerful. We really want to be 93rd out of 112. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 51:02
And so I think it drives that that message home, you know, as you’re promising all this information, and then it’s like, okay, well, if we want to get to where we’re comparable to our neighboring districts, yeah, this is what we need. Yeah. This is what the steering committee has said, we need

Unknown Speaker 51:21
at least 2% baseline, and they said, 50%, and then optimally was

Unknown Speaker 51:27
the opposite. And I don’t think we want to really have a yes, it is nice to have that slide at the end. And here’s your choices. But it’s not. But the thing is, is that you there is a risk in adding that piece in there, because you’ll have some people, and actually, I’m trying to think of personalities on council. Right. Thank you. And I, I think that, you know, most everyone on council, if not all, really want to have an adequately funded library. For those of us who are you in the social justice realm and just fighting for equity. The library is the way that meets those needs. Because they offer free services, and it brings it’s a hub for and we you know, we want to have it a multicultural, we want to have it be comfortable for for folks from different backgrounds and language that they can come in. And in order to to have that happen. We have to have the funding to back that. So I think, you know, it’s really creating this, building up that narrative. This is what we want to get, you know, then this is what we need.

Unknown Speaker 52:46
Okay, all right. So you were right, I was wrong. This is what she does her little

Unknown Speaker 52:59
place where I certainly do not want to give anyone the impression that I want to hold back information. How do we time that information so that we can have the discussion, we need to have it what I’m hoping for from counsel just for your benefit? Is really, you know, to hear like, if it’s going to give you an evidence, and we come back to refer to that team with a preferred option, are we gonna have considered everything we need to consider? Are those are there things in here that we’re not considering that we need to be aware of? And there is a sleight of hand here that is kind of like a laundry list of other questions here. Questions or evaluating options, where I actually am hoping that people will share those, because I do think there are some really important questions here. So you know, things like one time implementation costs, there’s, there’s layers to this analysis that we will need to add in capital costs. You know, how would the city be interested in Central Library and libraries for holding that relationship? You know, what is tax burden going to look like for residents? Even in the library district, you know, I think it’s easy to think, Oh, well, the city will just keep those tax dollars and the library district will charge the additional, even if that passes, at some point that could be very difficult for the city, because city residents will be looking at the overall tax burden. And let me tell you, other than my job, nobody looks at their their property taxes in an itemized way. Never really show like, Oh, I get so you know, I get charged so much for property taxes. And they pick a government to blame here, Washington offense state, but, you know, Lee County, but you know, it could be the city too. And people necessarily understand that you’re getting taxed by a number of different to your taxing districts and child governments and it’s not just The city’s property tax. And so the library districts were charging their own mill levy, that’s an impact the city and some people are going to be unwilling to pay for property taxes, even if the cities and the district.

Unknown Speaker 55:17
Yeah, I have a question. Has Has there been any kind of like a hybrid of municipal and library district, in in any of the research or anything that you have seen in communities.

Unknown Speaker 55:35
There’s two things like the hybrid, but they’re what I would say is very minimal, like they’re very low down in terms of heights restaurants, have a hybrid in the sense that the library district could be formed, and it could contract back with the city services. What I would say is that, just like you’re talking about a very tiny economy is very tiny efficiency, right? tons of money. And it isn’t really even at the level where it’s worth showing that as a separate option. It’s such a small potential efficiency, I think it’s idea that you could have a library district with the city with still government is kind of antithetical to wildlife. That sort of hybrid where it’s a taxing district. And, but the city government doesn’t like this. However, you can effectively do that, what that would look like, because he would pass a levy for the library, and then the city council would still govern the library, and you’d have this dedicated levy for the libraries. And you could indicate to taxpayers that, hey, if we need more money for the library, we’re going to update this this village. Right, right. That’s how the light all the libraries funding comes from this military. And you certainly could do the same thing with sales and use tax doesn’t really have the same effect for residents. Because that’s not how people experience their sales and use tax, it’s not the same as your property tax free. Child government library. So you know, it does exist in that way. But it’s not really, it’s just a way of extracting that municipal governance model. And that’s where I’d say, you know, that municipal governance model is dozens of different ways, you could make an argument that one way to do this would be for the city to find the money within the general funds, and to go out for levy for something else, you’d like to let the levy or the library access the resources. But in order to do that, that means we’re not when it lost her a levy, or whatever recreational services, whatever it is. So that’s where it seems like this idea of how we express them useful governance is very, very, there’s many options for that. Piping relates to how you respond or not. So yeah, I mean, it’s normally because it’s hybrid, because it really is just something you’re already allowed to do.

Unknown Speaker 58:12
So it really wouldn’t save any money or for the taxpayer as far as the lowering that what they put in for the district. And that’s what I was kind of looking at what can we do to kind of bring down that cost, and maybe core, you know, connect the two fundings from the city and the district,

Unknown Speaker 58:31
it seems like what has been important in areas that I’ve seen, and like I said, most of the complaints ahead of time about boulder are, you know, that they didn’t seem like they expressed a plan well for what they’re doing with their current budget. And so, you know, some some entities have, have literally given the money back to the taxpayers have said, Okay, here’s our, you know, here’s your current $4 million, and you get a lot of you get some money back. And that’s one option that

Unknown Speaker 58:58
will lower your sales, something like that. And then

Unknown Speaker 59:01
the other option is that you have a well thought out plan of where it’s going. And you say, you know, because of because we need more for this human services, you know, option or housing or, you know, homelessness services or whatever. But I think, you know, whatever, whatever happens, it’s really important to have a plan for what happens. Could have Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 59:23
I just think, going to the vote of the people, yes. So they have

Unknown Speaker 59:28
a right to know what happened.

Unknown Speaker 59:31
There are too many questions. It was one of the things that I heard from residents, folks that I talked to the other teachers families with the right now is that there were too many unknowns. There were too many questions as far as the messaging that went out. So as long as the messaging is very clear, that this is what we want. This is what’s going to happen at the end if we have this piece. I think that that adds that clarity for the voters. And I mean, And I’d be false as the people. It’s like, you know, you’re pinching pennies here. Yeah. It’s kind of what you’re doing. So we don’t have that extra expenditure. So that thought of an additional tax is very unnerving, especially with high inflation and

Unknown Speaker 1:00:14
the research going on right now. No, that’s just city in taxes is very, you know, it’s very real. So and people are very worried. So so it was, Harold, particularly Harold brings us up regulations, we can only tax people so much. And then they’ll just say, No,

Unknown Speaker 1:00:30
yeah, I was driving on county where they had to pass a tax in late 20 plus years. So. So we came

Unknown Speaker 1:00:39
in this tape, because I noticed when I walked through the LF overwrites was a school, and the bonds were able to get those past because the messaging is very clear. This is what the money’s going to be spent on. And I think how the district puts out the flyers and what goes out, you know, and then they also coordinate with CEA Chair of Education Association. So it’s a joint effort. So I think when we are going out there, it’s very clear to the voter, what this money is going to be spent on and the return is for our children. Yeah. So I think library, you know, it’s the same. I think it’s not like asking for something frivolous? This is something that’s very necessary to any community. So I think, you know, the messaging and the timing of what what do you bring out? And like you were saying, so you’re not really hiding any information, but you’re being strategic in how it’s being disseminated? Well, I

Unknown Speaker 1:01:40
think we were asked in, you know, our priority based budgeting this year, and last year to you know, this is like, the easiest thing I’ve ever done in budgeting is to say, you know, how do these budget requests affect equity? And, you know, if they get over once we win? Yeah, everything we do is about is about equity. So, you know, I think it’s

Unknown Speaker 1:02:05
low income people an opportunity to change literature, to attain

Unknown Speaker 1:02:09

Unknown Speaker 1:02:11
literacy, build that liberty. So and that will really levels the playing field for education.

Unknown Speaker 1:02:17
The piece I could add on, is that if you are to go on to the voters, we need to also figure out the capital side of this. Wouldn’t want it, they shouldn’t have to be related, yes, want to do those two, separately. And so I think that would potentially make these numbers much larger, even if you’re just going for a lease, or if you’re going to finance any new facilities, which is very likely to finance facilities. Want to build that into the how we think of this, as well as what would it cost on an annualized basis for those new facilities, and what is our sinking funds or revenue, your long term need to replace any existing equipment, and replace existing facilities, and you want to build that all into one package that you ask the voters for. And if you didn’t do that, you would want to build it into a package. And you’re gonna renew it. The second part, so, for example, you might decide, we don’t want to build two library branches at once. But you know, we’re going to build one library branch, and we’ll have a lease. And then when the first library branches built, if you pay down that debt, you know, maybe we were able to do finance it over 10 years instead of 20. At that park, that we’re going to build the next branch, you know, so that basic piece is also going to be really important. But some of that is really like, we have to first establish the willingness of the community to pay for the good and desirable services. And we have to establish the willingness of council to do you know, to carry out those wishes. And if not establish a library district periodicals.

Unknown Speaker 1:04:00
I totally agree with this in the Chicago area. Before I left, there were a number of communities that put two separate items up one was for buildings, and one was for operating. And a lot of them passed the building measures and not the operating metric. So we literally one of them, built built this whole second floor and their library will the library, and they crash and take off the second floor. And they said, they said we’ll see you up here when you pay for it. So and it worked. Yeah. But you know, having those things together is really important because they’re all definitely yeah, but then I noticed that boulder is also having discussions about which of the buildings they would be expected to pay for which of the buildings the city would you know, offer cities give you donate or make you pay $1 or whatever. And I know that the current library building here has some kind of leveraging it conference with Village at a peaks so that’s, that’s something that would have to be taken into consideration as well.

Unknown Speaker 1:04:58
But that is up in front yours.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:02
Yeah. Yep. So I appreciate your extra time. Yeah, I want to keep you too much longer. But we will definitely, I think need to go over some of the questions that we have. And then we’ll try and meet again if that’s possible.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:17
Yeah, that’d be great. Okay, thank you so much. Okay. I have some questions. We have, we have a lot more meat to this now to your, to your kids into my face.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:38
So you want to go to the questions before we get through the rest of them? To think about it. Well, my questions now.

Unknown Speaker 1:05:49
I thought we can’t answer. So biggest, best if you could write them all down. We can compile a list. We can do this. I think. So we skipped a feasibility study update verse. So.

Unknown Speaker 1:06:10
Okay, does anybody want to say anything but this before we move on? Your floor? Oh, no. Let’s go back to the beginning. We have to approve the minutes because we jump right into this. Everybody has an opportunity to take a look at the main minutes because

Unknown Speaker 1:06:31
at the end me this morning. I move that we approve

Unknown Speaker 1:06:40
this are you comfortable with these minutes? Because I’m not sure if they reflected everything that a lot of it. So you’re coming. Okay, so I’ll volunteer for Okay, minutes are approved? Do we have one? Yeah, you move around between the sheets will look like different classes. Okay, having said that, then we kind of did, what we thought we’re going to do is fill the study directors report, we

Unknown Speaker 1:07:27
came up pretty, pretty short and sweet. But we have a lot going on still. With our construction project, our second floor is still close. But the for the project is moving forward at a good pace and is hopefully slightly ahead of where we thought the schedule would be. We haven’t had the horrible surprises like we did on the first floor where they tell you stop don’t move a card over that grab that case, we didn’t even want to know in case with. So we have many many, many cracks upstairs. But they are the individual cracks are less serious than over that one sensor. So they are pretty much done with all of the grinding and that last and last stitching that they did last time. So staff will be happy. It’s been a little more difficult since we this time our lockers for COVID We have patrons in the building, and staff so we’re, you know, Shouting up the noise at the patrons. We have people crammed downstairs so that they have a place to sit, etc. But they’ve been remarkably, patrons have been markedly appreciative about what we’ve been able to do. So that we’ve stayed open instead of closing to do this and that we’ve accommodated them as best we can. So second floor is going really well. And we are I think the probably the most excited about the fact that we were able to carve out a much larger computer lab upstairs. So that’s taking shape, I think they’ll be standing at my desk tomorrow morning with some kind of wet stuff. And drilling holes for power and data. They said there was something with a slurry and they’ll have to come up with plastics and I’ll be able to the plastic sheet tomorrow. So it’s exciting to have that happen. So we just haven’t had a good, really good loud space. And we’ve even seen a difference in our chat space, which is now in part of the meeting room then we had a much more enclosed space upstairs before and for a lot of our cooks who struggle with some mental health issues etc. Just just not having that type of proximity has been very helpful. So we’ve seen a lot of folks much more comfortable that there’s some distance between them. So the less the less paneled walls, it’ll be around that and those are just waiting for it to be done there and adversity wins. So we’re looking forward to that. We’ve had a lot of repainting done we have staff has really pitched in like they did last time we do have movers but staff has done a good portion of it as well. So we’ve had to remove every single thing from every bottom shelf and then all of the smaller shell was upstairs to put it all back and clean it off. So just fine little desks and everything so. But when it’s done, I’m just really, really happy that we’ve been able to use some of these cosmetic things and not just infrastructure repair. Because if we closed for a while, and inconvenienced everyone that opened it up, and it didn’t look any different. Really, really impressive.

Unknown Speaker 1:10:23
Do you have to do any changes like as far as ADA compliancy? Or was it pretty good?

Unknown Speaker 1:10:28
upstairs? Upstairs, we’re pretty okay. I know that both of our elevators need to be repaired and rebuilt, and that will be happening pretty soon, they’re not great. Are, we probably have more staff ADA issues than patrons. So I still have concerns about some of those. I’m not even talking that about bathrooms. And so that’s an issue. But, you know, what should we have, I had multiple folks who’ve worked for me and other libraries and wheelchairs, and this one would be tough, because the only staff entrance has steep stairs that go to the back. Otherwise, you know, you would have to always call someone to come let you in one or the other doors or, you know, have to have something set up or seven other doors at certain times. And, you know, that’s not really something that you want to we want people to have an equal opportunity to get. So that’s this little problem. So I mean, definitely sell some things that this will make us, unfortunately, spaces or just have that. So I feel like we’ve pretty much eked out as much space as we can get since we got the construction folks to

Unknown Speaker 1:11:41
to build the road called the Creation Station. Yeah, but that

Unknown Speaker 1:11:45
was I don’t know, it’ll it’s not good. Use it too much. So because we have to put these two two staff members over there. We can’t just put one, zero. That’s a staffing issue. So it’s a safety issue for us if we put one person alone, folks in that building, because we have some folks that that can be problematic. So

Unknown Speaker 1:12:06
she can use it for offices.

Unknown Speaker 1:12:10
Possibly, except Jennifer Sandy about it,

Unknown Speaker 1:12:13
the person has to run down the block.

Unknown Speaker 1:12:15
I asked her and she said, Well, we’re thinking about a co working space for employees. I said, Have you thought about it? How about a studio for LPN? Because you’d have to talk to Joni. And I thought, you know, or if you could use bass, I mean, you have a building sitting there that has been under use for a year.

Unknown Speaker 1:12:40
But there’s a limit to how many folks you can have any referral program because we only have one washroom. So we did some looking into that. So we would need to have at least two washrooms to have more than like 10 people in the program. So it’s definitely limited its use. I’m not saying that it couldn’t be used. But I’m always worried that, that we use this thing, which really is not at all ideal for our purposes. And it’s definitely already have a building so you don’t need anything else. So that’s a, that’s an issue. But anyway, going along, we didn’t think we’d be looking at completion intent before maybe the end of May, I think it will be a lot sooner than just looking at how the progress is failing purpose about three quarters of the way through because they didn’t work an expensive option, which I understand is ridiculously expensive to have members who have all library shelving and take everything off. But they’re perfectly around gelling, with us taking off the bottom shelves and all this stuff. So it takes a long time to do Hancock Park around. So we’ve had a few shells fall apart. It’s interesting. And we had our bilingual outreach coordinator, which is already in position for us. She started today it was kind of interesting, because it said, Well, you will have a desk upstairs when you have a desk upstairs because your desk

Unknown Speaker 1:13:56
isn’t at

Unknown Speaker 1:13:58
this point. So we had her stuck in the boardroom for now. And she’s like half covered and not just in PPE, so so. So she’s incredibly excited though she comes to me. So her people from Boston Public Library, and she was basically running the local branch. And she, she has really hit the ground running because she said she and I sat down to raise the test. She’s already setting up her spreadsheets and making a list of contacts. So it’d be great for us to have that kind of coordination. We’ve scattershot outreach, but because of our staffing issues, that’s what it’s been. And it’s hasn’t been coordinated between sometimes adults who are in children’s, etc. And so we’re, we’re trying to have a centralized spot, a position that we would love in the future would be similar to that, which pretty much all the libraries that were I’ve worked with had a volunteer coordinator as well as once again, we have people trying to handle this and try to use volunteers and if you don’t, supervisor volunteers, they are not of any use to you. So we also struggled with that. And then, you know, something that’s a little bit later in the report. But we’ve been talking a lot about rewriting, you know, there are so many things, I when I think it’d be useful for us to make a list of the things that we can’t do with our current staffing. And that’s definitely, that’s definitely one that we’ve been talking about looking at. Because, you know, I’ve written a lot of grants over the years, I think I’ve received all that one. And I love grant writing, I don’t have time to maintain a grant, except for the state grants of those things, don’t have time to write grants, it may take months.

Unknown Speaker 1:15:35
And so on option one.

Unknown Speaker 1:15:39
I think, you know, I think that pays for itself. So I think that would be

Unknown Speaker 1:15:43
no, no, I mean, to your list of things to do. You don’t think it’ll be in option one?

Unknown Speaker 1:15:49
It would be? No, I mean, I would prefer to, I mean, I kind of look at the communities. And, you know, when I was in Kern, County, California, that’s, that’s a poor County. There, there are a lot of funding deficiencies. There, I would have been thrilled to get to baseline. But this is not that. This is not that community. And so, you know, I look at this community, and I say, why are you 93rd? Reading, and that, what that means to me is that the library is not a priority. And that there are, you know, it communities that are, that are more well to do, there are often larger discrepancies between the haves and the have nots. And, and that’s what bothers me is making sure that, you know, we have a lot of folks that use the library, I think we provide amazing customer service, I think we have a good collection, I think for a lot of folks that just put materials on hold and pick them up or use it electronically. They say, well, everything’s great. But we don’t know, you know, what, this is where our new outreach coordinator comes into, we don’t always know when we’re not starting. And when I don’t care, I didn’t even know this, I told you this, I don’t care anything about people who just don’t want to use leverage. I mean, that’s, if it’s not that big, it’s not that thing, that I care about people who would use the library, but they don’t have transportation, they feel uncomfortable, they are comfortable going to an apartment building, they feel like we don’t have enough staff, staff who speak their language, etc. So those are things that we always consider.

Unknown Speaker 1:17:18
So they’re more option, two things that you just take. What are you getting at? I don’t know. I don’t understand what’s in the face,

Unknown Speaker 1:17:31
I actually consider a baseline that if we are serving the public, I consider that baseline we should have an adequate number of staff who are fluent in Spanish, for example. Okay, so I’m just trying

Unknown Speaker 1:17:45
to understand it. So you know, we’ve got these numbers. If someone were to ask me, what’s in the base? Yeah. I’m not sure I can.

Unknown Speaker 1:17:54
Yeah, baseline would be would be a lot of what Annie has based baseline on is, you know, we would not be at that, that super low percentile as far as spending. So So I would say that our collection is probably close to baseline, our collection size is pretty good. And our collection is very well curated. I would say we’re close there. We’re not close on, on staffing numbers, we’re not close on, probably programs, we wouldn’t be anywhere near close at programs if they weren’t completely funded by friends. Right, for example. So I think there are things like that, where we are not at baseline, and, you

Unknown Speaker 1:18:37
know, just starting

Unknown Speaker 1:18:40
to sketch out questions calm, and definitely, you know, you look at those numbers of square footage per capita, just just the, the amount of space that you need for the for the population that we have. And you know, Kennedy shouldn’t be a focus. Our focus is always inviting more people to come this elaborate, and should we be doing that, and we don’t have anywhere to fit that. So yes, some are if we have to further you’ll get the questions.

Unknown Speaker 1:19:12
And more fortunate.

Unknown Speaker 1:19:13
Now we’re basically just taken up with trying to open up after COVID. Actually, we’ve had multiple kinds of fun things this past week, which is awesome. And I came in for a few hours on Sunday, because when I take a few days off, I have to work more to catch up. So we had the prom dress event. So we had we had about probably about 40 and women’s dresses. Yes. And those were cool. Do we have some leftover women, donate those elsewhere then take up a new production next year. We don’t destroy that. We had a staff member who made some really nice costume jewelry, all kinds of so a lot of folks who didn’t find a dress have sparked weddings and handbags and shoes. We had a young man that came in he was so excited to find a pair of men’s dress shoes that look like they’ve never But one that fit in perfectly so. So that was a lot of fun. And then we have our, I don’t know what how many years we went to the peeps contest. Yeah, but, but making things out of marshmallow meds. And they’re, they’re very literacy based. So So you definitely have, you know, like more of these. So there’s little combat costumes and, and so that’s been a lot of fun. So it’s just fun when I came in on Sunday just to see all of the chains and then in their team space, which we didn’t have till this year. And then I’ll family is just looking at the peeps. And we’ve seen a lot more folks, it’s kind of anecdotal, it’s hard to tell, but seems like more and more people are coming in, because we’re switched into the first floor. But you’re looking at our stats from last year and looking that they were back up to the 2019 levels will be closed for six months means that we like other libraries are gaining patrons as COVID. We have a lot of folks that came in that said, I haven’t mentioned the library here. But I started reading again. And it’s just, it’s it’s electronic materials. But it’s not just that. So it’s been great to see more people, I hope that COVID members don’t have to make it so that we can continue to add more folks in the library. And we hope to have our meeting room was back open soon since we’ve had to house our upstairs staff in half in our computer lab. And so hopefully we can have those open for programming again, in some way. So maybe

Unknown Speaker 1:21:30
after the end of May we can start reading their support.

Unknown Speaker 1:21:35
You should be I mean, you can meet there now I just I mean that the conference services stuff, he has driven the library, it has like no ventilation, and so that has people lined up seated outside of it right now. So you have to keep the door shut and it’s extremely steady. So yeah, we can we can probably after we move everybody else upstairs, we can clear some of that stuff out of the boardroom and be

Unknown Speaker 1:22:00
urging that I’m just saying, June

Unknown Speaker 1:22:03
you do? Yeah, you want to do that? Okay. I think COVID net, right? Everything depends on COVID. I’ve started coming over here at the end of the day, and so that so that people don’t come after me.

Unknown Speaker 1:22:20
You can always use the space. Okay,

Unknown Speaker 1:22:27
that’s good friend,

Unknown Speaker 1:22:29
or use a friend or friend or friends. So it was an interesting meeting. They are doing their book sale. And we volunteered this space for them. And they came over here and said no.

Unknown Speaker 1:22:46
Did you smile? I bet it’s way better than what we’ve got available? Well, no,

Unknown Speaker 1:22:49
it’s that. Oh, it’s getting the that’s our elevator. Oh, and getting the pallets and getting the books in here would have just been. So they’re going to try to do it over in the open space over in the civic center. So that’d be cool. So that’s what they’re shooting for. I brought up the fact that they have a foundation that is separate from the friends they didn’t know that the Board did not

Unknown Speaker 1:23:15
think they did know, the board itself. It’s only turned over as part of it.

Unknown Speaker 1:23:21
And I said, you know, what are the chances of you guys doing this? And they were they seem really positive about it. I think there is no proof. No proof came up to me afterwards. What you were saying? And she said, yeah, they need this crap out afterwards because they think they’re doing too much already and they can’t take on doing so what you can do that if you want to, but I want to have Marina Rhea fired up the London library district Corporation, nonprofit I created a few years ago. I’m meeting Justin, and he’s going to transfer the bank account I said a few years ago, he was gonna be on that board. And I’m gonna call Chris Burton, who he is the boulder Library Foundation. Oh, executive director. And they have a huge video 50 years old with millions. So I’m gonna hit him up about because before he worked for the boulder Community Foundation, and I think he has designs to create a Boulder County Library Foundation. Oh, cool. So I’m gonna see if he’s interested in doing that and having Boulder and Longmont Lewisville and Lockett? All of us, that’s very interesting. Yeah, have a have a county wide Library

Unknown Speaker 1:24:45
Foundation, and she would be interested. That’s interesting.

Unknown Speaker 1:24:49
So I’m gonna meet with him. Janet, sorry. On our steering committee for the

Unknown Speaker 1:24:57
Janet beers.

Unknown Speaker 1:24:58
Yep. Jeff Beardsley. No isn’t really well, she’s going to join us. They’re old friends. So I’m gonna send out, see what I can do to get to get a foundation started for a clever not directly related to friends but indirectly. That’s it. I thought. I thought so too. There’s no way I could like it. But apparently they had second thoughts. Yeah, I don’t think prudence wanted it. Prudence is a no.

Unknown Speaker 1:25:34
No, I just think that they maybe don’t understand how it works that it doesn’t have the tail all that much work on their part,

Unknown Speaker 1:25:40
I don’t understand. And they have one. It’s a separate from the friends library has almost $40,000 Just sitting there. And that’s why I couldn’t figure out what Eric was talking about way. So your library foundation. So

Unknown Speaker 1:25:53
that’s the thing he came, I had asked him to come out, we came out when I first got there and talked to the fencer, but his friends have had an almost complete turnover. So I think that’s where something about Boston transit.

Unknown Speaker 1:26:04
Yeah, the reason that boulder has a very successful Library Foundation is one woman spent 50 years building it up.

Unknown Speaker 1:26:11
That’ll do it.

Unknown Speaker 1:26:14
One person being laser focused on it for decades. So we’ll see we get going here. I’m too old. It’s been 50 years on something.

Unknown Speaker 1:26:25
Good career, what’s the date of the book sale?

Unknown Speaker 1:26:32
I think they’re also waiting to see how quickly our project is finished upstairs. Because they wouldn’t be able to if that gets done in the short term, then they can just have it back in the meeting rooms and stuff. So probably like someone think they’re hoping for me, but I tell us chickens so easy, it’s okay. They’ve been, it’s been hard for them to plan because they really want to plan for this. But I can’t like any construction project. I can’t tell you exactly what to do.

Unknown Speaker 1:27:06
In May. That’s what we’re saying. We’re saying late spring, which is even more.

Unknown Speaker 1:27:12
Actually, I have sooner than end of May.

Unknown Speaker 1:27:19
Assuming that we don’t end up with some

Unknown Speaker 1:27:23
Memorial Day

Unknown Speaker 1:27:27
Trades Academy?

Unknown Speaker 1:27:30
Yep, I think for sure. So let’s see. Last week Council, we met as the LBJ School of Law, my housing authority, so we didn’t have the regular session meeting. The meeting before that, though, we did. Here, the update for the sugar beet factory. Yeah, just update it. So I don’t know if y’all know, we have are working with going up older. So our third graders, my third graders, they’re doing the kids are doing a design challenge and really just prototyping what they would like to see in that space. And it was really interesting to see. So we had kits that some groups did a like a more like a children’s museum exploration zone. Different from our to our regular museum, but more was more interactive. So I haven’t been VR are different things that they can interact with. So that was that. And then we had another group, a couple of groups that did more of an activity. Kind of like a rec center. It was interesting because they were putting in ice rink and

Unknown Speaker 1:28:49
you know, they did the research, they looked at parks and recreation centers, not just in Colorado, but explored worldwide. So it was really it was really the third earners third graders. So we are STEM schools for years. And since they were preschool, they’ve been exposed to the design thinking the elite to build the empathy defined ideate prototype feedback. Yeah. So that whole, that whole process so it’s kind of ingrained in how they how they operate. But overwhelmingly what we heard from our students was that they don’t they’re, you know the air anytime they want it, you know, Waterworld, Boondocks, anything, they have to leave long. So they want to be able to have these amenities here in town. So they’re not having to leave a lot. So yeah. Small children. Yes, please. And, and it was interesting, because when we started talking exploring housing styles have your type they all gravitated toward, like apartments, townhomes, more worth, high density, but it was more condensed where there were community community garden parks and pools that were nearby rather than the

Unknown Speaker 1:30:11
newer ones.

Unknown Speaker 1:30:12
So, yeah, it was really interesting I mean, and we do not do not engage. So what do we do? We give the history Yeah, we you know, okay. These are the sites are allowed to look, you know, look through Kindle, you know, you search through Kindle, you cannot search open Google, so like different those mechanisms. But really, when you are, you know, they’re they’re visualizing what they want to see the research and then they come back with

Unknown Speaker 1:30:41
a child, why would you not one of the Yes to all your friends, you’ve got this part right here. You have these other user pool

Unknown Speaker 1:30:49
where you give it to a bunch of third graders, they come up naturally with new urbanism, they do.

Unknown Speaker 1:30:56
It and and the other thing, so our kids countryside village, yes, Esperanza. They, they live in a lot of yeah, do a lot with low income. Yeah. So they’re, they’re already in apartment settings are already in just close, connected spaces. And they also live with families. So it’s like, oh, you know, let’s face this facility, once connected spaces where they have shared, shared community places. So that was overwhelmingly whatever, when I heard, and so that’s what you know what’s interesting when I hear from people who’ve been here for generations, and they don’t want to see the growth, and I’m thinking about what our youth are saying had, they’re the ones that are going to be carrying this forward. So we really do need to listen to that argument is that is that the other one that was used on directly was last week we had doing democracy day. And it’s just so we had elected officials there. met the mayor was there and a couple of city council people they’re talking with talking with our youth. And it was, again, you know, homelessness, housing, housing is a big, big thing. And we’re, you know, as far as counseling, that’s one of our big challenges that we’re addressing now is just getting that attainable.

Unknown Speaker 1:32:13
30% growth cost last year. $675,000 average?

Unknown Speaker 1:32:19
Yeah, it’s insane. And I think Colorado, so I sit on the Latino Advisory Council for Congressman noose, and we met a few weeks ago. And just really comparing our stage to other states, our housing costs are just skyrocketing. Well, what other states are in an increase in other states? So

Unknown Speaker 1:32:42
we have think we’re third in the country right now in the states go for growth?

Unknown Speaker 1:32:49
I think so in terms of

Unknown Speaker 1:32:50
costs, and then as far as pay way, and we’re in the bottom. So wages are definitely not keeping up with bargain, negotiate with

Unknown Speaker 1:33:00
the distance, you’re looking at quality of life, being able to live and work in the same place

Unknown Speaker 1:33:04
to do that on Kindle, if you have to get

Unknown Speaker 1:33:10
cost of living. Yeah, to search for third grade. That was amazing. They were I was really proud

Unknown Speaker 1:33:20
of that you were really engaged.

Unknown Speaker 1:33:22
They were very engaged. And so that was

Unknown Speaker 1:33:25
that there’s nothing kids that age, like more than to be asked what they think.

Unknown Speaker 1:33:30
They say rose to that to that challenge. Yeah, so the housing, that update kind of thing. If we had anything else, I feel like there was something else I wanted to share. But after that, I’ve sent me an email.

Unknown Speaker 1:33:45
Is the council talking amongst yourselves at all about the library?

Unknown Speaker 1:33:49
So there has been some conversation I think we’re really like, looking forward to hearing about the feasibility with the feasibility study has to has to show, you know, conversations that I’ve had with folks. So you know, really, let’s take an open minded approach. You know, we might have our idea of what we want to see at the end. But if we are truly a democracy in your legs that people speak, that we need to hear, and better policy. So I tried to frame it in a way that took an open mic approach. A decision made

Unknown Speaker 1:34:26
report, what decision do you think they had made before?

Unknown Speaker 1:34:29
I don’t know I just I’m just throwing this out there. They want to make assumptions.

Unknown Speaker 1:34:34
Minister, like when I first arrived here, I think the oppression overall and not just council was just that everyone loves lettering. But then I looked at that disconnect between, you know, I just got it got here on the tail of the first priority based budgeting. We had nothing in the top 50% 50th percentile. And so everything was ranked as is unimportant. And then I looked at the community satisfaction survey and here’s the libraries that can only do public say At. And here’s this disconnect. Yeah, here’s this. It’s an email every once in a while somebody would say something like, oh, we have 30,000 extra dollars in the bank. Would that help you? Well, yes, but that’s not. That’s not it does not. So I am hoping that what this study addresses is really the the depths at that tipping point, and the deficit is larger than people realize. And yet, when compared with your libraries, and with just the needs of the community, so

Unknown Speaker 1:35:28
and the support that I have, the issue I have with the priority based budgeting is Okay, so let’s say, you know, we’re looking at this percentage piece, but let’s say that our, our indigenous population that make up a small portion of our community, as a whole would say, and I’m just making this up. But okay, so there’s a service that maybe tailors to that particular group, and 95% of that group utilizes and values that service, but then in relation to the community as a whole is no less than 5%. So then, where do we put, so we really, really wanting to build that equity, we have to look at how it ranks within those subgroups. So really, and I think, you know,

Unknown Speaker 1:36:13
90 something percent of people having a computer at their home, but you know, then looking at the COVID effect, and saying, Well, what about these folks have one computer or they have four people? How many computers were stolen?

Unknown Speaker 1:36:28
priority based budgeting always confused me, because I really think it came down to advocacy. Who’s out there? Most? I think that’s what the light

Unknown Speaker 1:36:44
is. So and you know, what are the arguments that we have in negotiations is when we’re looking at salaries, like you, you budget, and you put money into what you value that shows what you value. So if you put a small portion of the value that salaries know, if something else comes to mind, I’ll

Unknown Speaker 1:37:13
stop. I’m gonna move through some of these other ones because they think you’ve been reading the news, probably understanding what’s going on with respect to the boulder Reviver district, big issues there occurred on April 5 and April 7, April 5, they had a joint session between the county commissioners and the city council and talked through what they had planned for their library district may suddenly they have over 100 people waiting to be heard of the town hall. And at the end of that city council voted six to three in favor of moving the initiative forward. Then it went to the county, just the county commissioners on the seventh and they didn’t move at all. They elected not to take us position. Which is really a death knell to the initiative because there are certain deadlines that need to be

Unknown Speaker 1:38:26
met. Basically, they said that no, we’re not. We don’t want to do the district. We’re not going to approve it right now. You have to come back with these things are so

Unknown Speaker 1:38:34
they still can go around.

Unknown Speaker 1:38:36
Well, what they did, as they got the job, Johnny was kind of like the version of me there. Yeah, definitely. And she she was pissed off. Because they the county came to them and said expanded out into the county, please. Yeah. So Okay. Well, because they were going to do just the city. Not the county now the

Unknown Speaker 1:38:59
county back up,

Unknown Speaker 1:39:00
so they’re pissed. So she’s going back and she’s saying, Listen, we have enough people in they have 2000

Unknown Speaker 1:39:07
They laid 100. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:39:12
Now why did they decide not to

Unknown Speaker 1:39:14
they heard a lot of nose. They heard a lot of the anti tax people came up. And that’s not going to do any. Yeah. And there was one of the county commissioners, the newer one, I can remember her name. But she was kind of Claire lobby was the one she was actually quite against it, which really surprised me. So anyways, the district

Unknown Speaker 1:39:37
or the multiple things against the formation of a district or or against the amount of funding there. I think it was

Unknown Speaker 1:39:46
a timing issue, I think with with inflation and stuff like that, and people perceived that they were they didn’t know how they were going to impose higher taxes on them. be able to,

Unknown Speaker 1:40:01
she said, people are telling me they don’t know how they’re going to stay in their houses. Now that’s that now that is kind of I mean, extreme. It’s, it’s 20 to $50 a year per. For a million dollar house.

Unknown Speaker 1:40:17
That’s right. Yeah. So like 179 Something for yes. $27

Unknown Speaker 1:40:21
per 100,000. Yeah. valuation. So I don’t know, are you? Do you ever eat at McDonald’s either three times a month? Well, then you’ve spent your there is so don’t tell me you can’t, I don’t want to live in a million dollar house. You can afford it.

Unknown Speaker 1:40:38
She can also want you during the presentation, like, hold together numbers about approximately what it would cost? Sure.

Unknown Speaker 1:40:47
Absolutely. So I think because

Unknown Speaker 1:40:48
when you look at a large that is it’s like, Oh, my God, he was like, Well, no,

Unknown Speaker 1:40:51
we’re not asking like one or two, chicken, chicken do that. Right? What would it

Unknown Speaker 1:40:55
cost the average,

Unknown Speaker 1:40:56
we just found out what the melodies are worth here, we asked Jim, and it’s 1.8 million per mil. So we would need somewhere between two to four. So at the low end to high end 3.7 or something. So yeah, I can just take just just

Unknown Speaker 1:41:18
actually hit numbers in her her candle, but I’m not sure I understood how she got but I and she she references $350,000 house and then discuss on average 75. So that was not

Unknown Speaker 1:41:39
a lot of good data. But

Unknown Speaker 1:41:41
if you’re at two points, nine, seven. Let’s see.

Unknown Speaker 1:41:46
I just did back in the yellow calculation that Scott did I say, Okay, well, that’s 8 million bucks. That’s, that’s for mills.

Unknown Speaker 1:41:55
point you said it was point five, one Mills per 1000 hours, that’s $173,000.

Unknown Speaker 1:42:04
That’s already wrong.

Unknown Speaker 1:42:07
I couldn’t tell whether she was doing a promo over existing. Se one of my questions,

Unknown Speaker 1:42:16
and that’s, that’s the stuff that will, cause somebody’s gonna find that they’re gonna point that out, and they’re gonna see this entire thing is BS. You gotta be careful, she’s gonna be on here. So So that’s so that’s, I think, what they did was they’re, they’re going to force it through now. If they’re gonna put it on the ballot, regardless of whether the Motor City Council approves it, or the city county approves it. They’re just like, We’re done with you. I understand that.

Unknown Speaker 1:42:48
I have you too, because it’s been like six years with them. Yeah. But do you think that the county commissioners will actively work against

Unknown Speaker 1:42:59
it won’t matter because they’re not going to do for county, they’re only.

Unknown Speaker 1:43:03
That’s right, they sent back to the city. And so that’s been brutal.

Unknown Speaker 1:43:11
And we made it pretty clear our last leverage district meeting that to Ottawa representative, but right now, we’re not really considering the county, and if they want to be part of the district, if we go that route, and then come ask us and convince us that it’s a good idea. I was gonna ask

Unknown Speaker 1:43:30
David Fernan about that. And he said, you know, from there, he’s the director in Boulder, and he said, for their calculations, that’s not a money, isn’t it? It’s a wash. The amount that you gain in taxes for nine what you’d spend on a branch because they’re not going to vote for that branch.

Unknown Speaker 1:43:46
Isn’t a weird? Their position is accurately this. We don’t we’re free riders. We don’t pay for the boulder library or the Longmont library, we use boats. And we like it that way. We like not paying for services. They’re a bunch of

Unknown Speaker 1:44:02
bucks, which is why they’re going to ask for a grant. They are going to pay something and they want to get something for it. So they’re going to ask for a wrench. But I would love personally, and this is just me. Speaking I think we really need probably two graduates in the lab before I would say

Unknown Speaker 1:44:19
the problem is that the problem of Iowa is that they it’s mostly older people have kids, their kids are grown. They’re wealthy. They don’t use the library. They use their Kindle and

Unknown Speaker 1:44:33
they find we have quite a few residents that use

Unknown Speaker 1:44:38
the ones who have money here and the loud ones that quiet the majority of them, this tiny minority that’s very loud, are the rich ones. Those are the ones that were showing up at these meetings. And I’d say that we were some of the younger people in that room at that meeting. You and I 65 on Saturday, so I don’t think that this you know, these guys were definitely not

Unknown Speaker 1:45:00
You know, if you believe in security theories, it was almost like copy staff put an anchor into the process. Because nyuad really wasn’t in favor of that by having them in the mix. It complicates that and brings in burnings in that county. Whereas if you just keep it within the city district

Unknown Speaker 1:45:24
so their intention initially was just you, Boulder.

Unknown Speaker 1:45:27
Yeah. Yeah. So that was a favorite of the county in the county screw. That’s really what happened. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:45:33
I didn’t do. Okay, so that’s definitely what’s happening with Boehner moto comm. This Lomov library district committee, the big news there was that we met with Suzy, that was the really big news. And she gave us a piece of art. What she expected, she was very gracious. It was it was great hear from her. And then we also had a chance to meet with some of the senior folks from the city Herald and to assist them. See, injures

Unknown Speaker 1:46:12
Joanie in San Sandy and Jimbo

Unknown Speaker 1:46:15
and St. Shim willing to engage and willing to talk through the process as

Unknown Speaker 1:46:22
we move forward. I was aggressively out for him to show up in one meeting. That was my first time. Yeah. So they’ve taken us seriously, that’s good.

Unknown Speaker 1:46:32
Which, which will probably come back when we talk about dates or when the presentation wire so the curve? Okay. Si, P. P, we understand what P is program. So this is a carryover from last one, probably,

Unknown Speaker 1:46:55
I don’t have anything specific on this right now. But but you know, we I do see things over because I do see grant opportunities. And here they are sometimes when we apply for them, if they but I hate to have our criteria based on what we can handle timewise and not necessarily on how beneficial the grant would be. No, that’s where we are.

Unknown Speaker 1:47:20
So the reason I wanted to keep this on here was was you know, I don’t see the board writing the grants, but there might be things we can do to help the library. At least point that aspect of when we talk to people that hey, this is an opportunity that’s, that could be addressed. But if staffing or funding were a little different, that you might be able to send resources that way that that actually makes money for the library and reduces the impact on the city. So that

Unknown Speaker 1:47:55
grant writing, I was sent to a grant writing workshop in her eyes in Kern County that had an eight point something million dollar budget for 25 branches. So that’s how bad the funding is here. spread out over 8000 miles. That was interesting. But I go to this rent workshop and everybody else who’s there are grant writers, they’re there. And I thought I had I’m going to this to find out some ways that I could somehow squeezed support was the word grant funding. And they were like, well have your grant writer do this and thinking well, that would be me. 20 believers, but there we got to do. The typical grant scenario is that they pay for stuff and understanding. That’s always an issue in libraries. Because in Kern County, oh my gosh, I get I turned a old microfilm room into a GED testing lab because we partnered with probation, that was a good a good grant to do because people went for their sort of other degrees while they were incarcerated and then got out and they weren’t allowed to go back to jail in prison. But we got so much stuff. We had 3d printers, we had laser cutters, vinyl cutters, you know, fancy silicon sheet with everything for the most fabulous in space, but the most fabulous and makerspaces and we didn’t have any staff to run it.

Unknown Speaker 1:49:10
So that’s why you gotta have a good community, right? Why Tinkerbell works, it’s

Unknown Speaker 1:49:17
so bad when you’re in a community that doesn’t have high education standards, etc. Trying to find high tech volunteers was not a simple aspect. So I do want to keep this on, like bring some more information. It’s a frustration

Unknown Speaker 1:49:31
because I think there’s probably people you know, we can introduce it to the conversation and talk to the right people and talk to the community.

Unknown Speaker 1:49:40
And there are there are some grants that there are more this discussion started because there for a long time, the NEA grants, federal grants that applied to library infrastructure, to you know, buildings, etc, had totally disappeared. And now the last few years of There are some federal grant monies that are available that are apparently under applied for general remember that I saw a whole bunch of libraries that are pretty well heeled in California that applied for him. And so you know, and some of them would be, I saw one that was $17 million, you know, for let’s, let’s build a branch. Let’s do this. And so, so there are some grants that have been kind of under the radar yet, but that are available, but people have to bug their Congress, people, etc. about them. So that’s the type of thing I think we’re members could help with is some of that, if those type of grants come up is, is helping bring them to the attention to people who make decisions.

Unknown Speaker 1:50:39
So are this grant writing such a unique capability that somebody from city staff couldn’t,

Unknown Speaker 1:50:50
it is a skill set?

Unknown Speaker 1:50:51
Well, and you need to know the entity you know about the entity for which your soul

Unknown Speaker 1:50:58
really comes back to you and whatever time it is to do it. Okay,

Unknown Speaker 1:51:03
which is doing it. It’s that I like writing it and the writing, it isn’t the most time consuming part. It’s the maintenance usually, you know, quarterly reports. And keeping,

Unknown Speaker 1:51:17
there’s always strings attached.

Unknown Speaker 1:51:19
So I did forget, April 21. At 6pm. We have our joint meeting, city council and school board. Oh, the agenda? Yes.

Unknown Speaker 1:51:28
Bringing their shields and your swords? Yeah. I’ve never seen it.

Unknown Speaker 1:51:36
I brought it up. And this was badly on air. And I said, you know, we have joint meetings with our county commissioners, with judges, with our Congress, people without state legislators. But you know, that’s excellent. So So yeah, of course. I was teaching.

Unknown Speaker 1:51:56
Well. That’s the reason for that, you

Unknown Speaker 1:52:01
know, that we don’t Yeah, well, I’m a reasonably good fit for you. Good for you. So we have we meet on the 21st 6pm. One of the agenda items is Library District. We’re also going to be talking about the CDC childhood education and housing. Okay, so why don’t I send that to you, I put library I put the library update, I put preschool ecde update anything that would have pertained to school district business, as well as in for me housing, I really would like from wages. But I don’t know if that would be like, bringing that faith because I’m on board meeting. So I really do have to draw my butt. But really, yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:52:53
So how do you think the conversation will center around the labor district? What do you think will be?

Unknown Speaker 1:53:00
What they know? I want to know, what is their input? I want to know, you know, the support that we have not necessarily fiscally but you know,

Unknown Speaker 1:53:11

Unknown Speaker 1:53:14
or not work for them? Yeah. Isn’t it a competing isn’t seen by the school district

Unknown Speaker 1:53:19
saralee for property well, okay. So that’s the impacts could be that the override piece, because we are very good about getting our millennial rights pass getting those bonds. So it would be interesting to hear what what the argument is. And I also believe that that’s also good to know, as far as messaging, negotiating, and, you know, because we’re vying for for community support.

Unknown Speaker 1:53:49
We know. You know, the pressing thinking is alumni. Why? Because it’s part of the school district. So that would be an issue.

Unknown Speaker 1:53:59
Yeah. And I want so we need pizza as part of the theater. So Burlington Indian Peaks. Sunset is a long long school. The only school that is, you know that how elegant. I want Elementary. Yeah. And it is like the numbers aren’t arson feeders small. We get I have a lot of nyuad residents in the nightlife feeder elementary already, but it’s coming from Burlington any day weeks. Okay. So you could see how the numbers of children were families in that night water school, the high school high school so then all the kids that go to sunset, all are filled to my one high school. Yes.

Unknown Speaker 1:54:43
Transsexual person. I was so good guess the question. I start off I tend to start off with district discussions with any group is just that. I think people need to to think about and look into why the state of Colorado More than half of the library districts is planning.

Unknown Speaker 1:55:08
So yeah, so if you are available, feel free, it’s open to the public. At the Innovation Center.

Unknown Speaker 1:55:19
Interesting. Is it going to be broadcast or anything? Or is it just

Unknown Speaker 1:55:24
I don’t have no idea.

Unknown Speaker 1:55:27
Go in person is in person. So you have to ask lpm to do it.

Unknown Speaker 1:55:32
Because that said somebody. Did anybody ask? Maria,

Unknown Speaker 1:55:42
that’d be a nice. I think that would be something that would be nice to have recorded. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 1:55:46
we record these and punch them.

Unknown Speaker 1:55:50
Yeah. So no, because I think didn’t we have our legislative when we met with our county commissioner and our state reps, was it recorded?

Unknown Speaker 1:56:05
If you did on Zoom? It was

Unknown Speaker 1:56:06
we did it? Well, one we did on Zoom

Unknown Speaker 1:56:09
before. If you don’t ask that, and we don’t. Okay. Sandy and her team have to tell us I think I’ll see if anybody else. Consider that or it’s updated. I think that’s kind of one way to get the word out. So

Unknown Speaker 1:56:26
important. Yeah, I was really shocked that we do not have joint meeting with the scores. Because we overlap. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 1:56:37
Yeah, a lot of common interests. So yeah, it makes a lot of sense.

Unknown Speaker 1:56:41
I think it’s important that we know what entities, what are our priority? What are their priorities, and services and

Unknown Speaker 1:56:48
community? She goes on the agenda, that picture so you can’t go just yet. Okay. So why don’t you tell us what you think you know, about the shooting Council meeting on April.

Unknown Speaker 1:57:04
Now that it will be on the night and have to cure a girl. But we’re. And basically, that’s when we found out that originally, and he was going to do this as a two part thing, and had a little different division of what was going to be part one and part two. And then, you know, Harold basically said he wanted to reach this point. I have her presentation. And so she’s been working on the financials, but I was not comfortable putting this up on the meeting without any of us having a chance to discuss it, and go over that. But we really I agree. We didn’t like

Unknown Speaker 1:57:42
No, we were not happy. So you heard us though, he was like, Yeah, you know, you promise to make sure it got to us.

Unknown Speaker 1:57:51
So it sounds like it’s gonna be the point. He said, I have. So he also mentioned me, but it sounds like

Unknown Speaker 1:57:57
well, he meant and the reason he mentioned May was because they felt originally that would be more than a study session would be more conducive to allowing more time for creative work discussion. He told her give the presentation that 15 minutes. She kind of blanched at that. She does not show it’s not been a bit it. That’s what she said, if it really needs it to be that you need to tell me what to kind of

Unknown Speaker 1:58:24
Thank you led P which is you know, one for

Unknown Speaker 1:58:27
a lot of lawyers,

Unknown Speaker 1:58:28
you know, they argue.

Unknown Speaker 1:58:32
And granted, I don’t want to be as you know, long winded as

Unknown Speaker 1:58:36
well. long winded This is might be in order.

Unknown Speaker 1:58:40
Yeah. I know that if you don’t have any backgrounds at all, then people are not going to

Unknown Speaker 1:58:47
know what’s going on what happened last time this week. That’s what happened was we didn’t have time, and we didn’t have the exposure to counsel to go over. We didn’t have this. And so everybody made assumptions and said things like, you know, you’re taxing the house. If you’re building property in Longmont, you’re I mean all this stuff they made up and you know that.

Unknown Speaker 1:59:08
So I mean, that’s the thing. I mean, because we got a lot of pushback about why you have this long situation assessment to go with it. And I have you want it? Well, no, I wanted it

Unknown Speaker 1:59:21
to justify your position.

Unknown Speaker 1:59:24
Even even if it’s even if most folks don’t read all 68 pages or whatever, it’s there. So if they so if someone says How did you come to this conclusion is in this situation says on page 34? Here’s where we got it

Unknown Speaker 1:59:37
so significant. So some

Unknown Speaker 1:59:40
fun outside my words. So I’m thinking you I will be one I was

Unknown Speaker 1:59:45
it was important. Okay, so let’s

Unknown Speaker 1:59:49
see. So she was planning to come in and hopefully early and meet with the board just prior to that meeting. That’s one of my Estimating Yes, for this. That’s awesome. I mean, if we should I still think we need to meet?

Unknown Speaker 2:00:06
Yes. Because we because expects to meet us right before the council changes we

Unknown Speaker 2:00:12
so here’s here’s the difficulty that when you’re looking at these days, and there has been sat they’ve been said there was a personal issues with some personnel in the city clerk’s office that have made me well, that someone had done the daily. So it is been, you know, urged that we get things in and even earlier for them for everything to be compiled into the package on a job and reviewed. So I’m thinking for the 26th. I think we’ll have to have things in total everything the whole package, and, you know, the PowerPoint presentation and everything finalized by the 18th.

Unknown Speaker 2:00:55
So, do we have a special meeting for this group? I think we

Unknown Speaker 2:01:00
were trying to figure out the other the other alternative would be just to tell them, You’re not going to be ready, and we’ll do it today. And change the only change for wire position, but I’d rather see it

Unknown Speaker 2:01:14
this way. I mean, I think that we need we still have some questions.

Unknown Speaker 2:01:18
I really do and may and have an hour.

Unknown Speaker 2:01:22
It is not about I mean, it’s only I we bumped into this 26 provisionally because I had to get it off the the at

Unknown Speaker 2:01:30
15 minutes is not going to cut it. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 2:01:33
So I think I think we should go for what I have to say which which one is the study, which one is the study session? And may I have to look at this

Unknown Speaker 2:01:42
session, it would be counsel doesn’t

Unknown Speaker 2:01:45
know it, but I can look online. I went online and send it to you guys, which was a study session.

Unknown Speaker 2:01:53
Well, okay, so. So my interested in all this is to give this board enough time to be able to send an opinion on to come to me campus to

Unknown Speaker 2:02:05
study the 10th question on Susie about study sessions do they do in public might

Unknown Speaker 2:02:12
be hurt? Oh, yes. Yeah. Just have one public invited to do her. Okay. Yeah. And you’d want to be before the presentation anyway. Right. Right. Yeah. Right. So that’s fine.

Unknown Speaker 2:02:27
And we would like to be able to say that we have seen the study and we either endorse it or billing or food or would point out certain things to council that time may not allow to come out. You know, the normal breeze on

Unknown Speaker 2:02:47
Tuesday. So the first Tuesday would be May 3 is a Sunday session. Gel first and third Tuesday is what this website says. Let me go to the actual calendar, though. Because I know that like this, like, there’s one of the weeks that there isn’t a meeting. The third is not a meeting. Yeah. So they get 26 minutes skips to the 10th, which is a regular thing. So this isn’t the 17th and

Unknown Speaker 2:03:19
18th. So what do you think? That’s right. For? Well, when you think this will go up, if we say you let’s push it to me,

Unknown Speaker 2:03:33
when you push it to that, if you push it to the 17th, we would probably have to have anything in a week earlier than

Unknown Speaker 2:03:38
you should have. Done. But yeah. So then,

Unknown Speaker 2:03:44
I think I think it will be done before then I think it’s push now considering that we have we have more staff to work with. But we also have questions. And I think, you know, she’s really, absolutely open to us helping to refine this information into you know, because different things work in different ways. So I think she’s completely open to having us refine this. Now. I always respect it’s interesting, because I’ve been a part of a lot of strategic planning, and visibility type studies. And you I always want to refine the information. So it’s understandable and communicable. But, you know, there’s a reason we have an outside person doing this too. So I provide I will answer questions. I will ask questions, I will provide information, but I’m not going to say well, that’s doesn’t make the city sound too good. Or the this or this does or you know

Unknown Speaker 2:04:33
this. No, you’re not you’re not. Okay.

Unknown Speaker 2:04:39
So, so let’s let’s just assume 17th is the day. I don’t know if it will be or not. So then we would want to see it. A week before that

Unknown Speaker 2:04:51
I was there long before that. This month. No, I mean, for me, that’s reasonable. Meeting in the board. Oh, yeah, I know our wins our next board meeting

Unknown Speaker 2:05:03
six teams, but the six

Unknown Speaker 2:05:06
I think we need these.

Unknown Speaker 2:05:09
Whenever you set it for,

Unknown Speaker 2:05:11
well just depends on what we see the sunset in it until we have the data. So no, I mean, I can set a date, but I need when will we hear the day when we have

Unknown Speaker 2:05:21
a final? Well by the 26th, for sure. Which

Unknown Speaker 2:05:26
is final as it was, would be

Unknown Speaker 2:05:30
my recommendation to you always to try and get the 26. But then if you’ve got extra time before rather than talking to people. So you should still try and hit the 26. And we can set up meetings and then we need the second day, we could make we could make the second? Yeah. You should.

Unknown Speaker 2:05:52
I mean, you’re the only one that can talk to all of us

Unknown Speaker 2:05:54
or not. But I’ll do that. I can do do a roll or whatever. Yeah, perfect. That’s easiest. And then what I will need from all of you to what I will ask in an email is looking at this. Your what questions or suggestions for additions or deletions that you have? And then you need to send those to me not? Not, you know, don’t rely on always. You guys are really good, though. Like last couple of months. I’m very aware of such. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 2:06:25
So you do believe that we’ll have it in our little hands on the 26th. It depends

Unknown Speaker 2:06:31
on how many questions and how many deletions and changes and amendments you make? Well, the answer was

Unknown Speaker 2:06:37
yes. Yes. Yes, sir. Really should be regardless of any of those things should be yes, yes. Okay, okay. All right.

Unknown Speaker 2:06:52
I have to consult with her first to make sure she’s available on May 17. That’s what he said or whatever now. For what, to come to online,

Unknown Speaker 2:07:04
to her to counsel on base.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:07
She should release them to.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:12
approved by Council, she should really try and hit that date that they want them on the 17th.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:20
They don’t you just put it on

Unknown Speaker 2:07:24
the agenda. All right. Take it let’s go. You’re wanting

Unknown Speaker 2:07:30
to study session, not a regular.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:32
That’s what I’ve been told that. Yeah. We want

Unknown Speaker 2:07:35
we want a significant portion of that time.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:37
Yeah. Nice. Regular Session,

Unknown Speaker 2:07:43
if you want things on the agenda, because you’re not doing as many things that people are holding on.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:46
And the 26th of April is a regular guys. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:53
But I can certainly tell you that we want the finished product by the 26th.

Unknown Speaker 2:07:58
Because I know Harold is expecting that. So he’ll have a lot of questions if we don’t have something.

Unknown Speaker 2:08:03
Yeah, he was expecting it on it.

Unknown Speaker 2:08:05
But part of it is that I had never spoken to Harold, ever until until that meeting with Ken about this. So you know, I did not know

Unknown Speaker 2:08:15
what he says he talks you

Unknown Speaker 2:08:18
know, we should wander over to City Hall someday I’ll do Shinto

Unknown Speaker 2:08:25
say we have a ton. I mean, we’ve talked like, you know, I’m here to pick up my hold that I’m having a long conversation about

Unknown Speaker 2:08:34
this. He made it sound like you guys are so okay. We did. We

Unknown Speaker 2:08:38
said I mean we had a conversation with he and Karen at night.

Unknown Speaker 2:08:43
No, this was like recently, like you. Oh, okay.

Unknown Speaker 2:08:48
Well, yeah, the impression he left us was that his deadline was about

Unknown Speaker 2:08:54
I’d say we’re done Susie if you really want to.

Unknown Speaker 2:08:57
Sorry. Yes, we are adjourned.

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